Discussion:
I cannot forget... אני לא יכול לשכוח (revised)
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Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
2018-01-28 18:41:08 UTC
Permalink
I cannot forget...
אני לא יכול לשכוח

© STEPHAN PICKERING / חפץ ח"ם בן אברהם
12 Shevet 5778 / 28 January 2018

Shabtai Zisel / 'Bob Dylan' (1964):
'Forget the dead you've left, they
will not follow you'

W.G. Sebald z"l (1966):
'And so, they are ever returning to us,
the dead'

I.

the Path / derekh is silent,
a vacuum,
resonating with the
footsteps of tzaddikim, whose
teachings transcend(ed)
the Kingdom of Night...

where there was no longer
kefitzat ha'derekh
shrinking of the road
jumping the Path
teleportation.

...un die vvelt hot geshivign,
taught Reb Elie Wiesel z"l...
& the world remained silent.

not existing for themselves,
the tzaddikim speak with the
Shekhinah from their throats,
and the mar'ot johanna
visions of johanna
are witnessed by breslover
chavurot on desolation row,
murmurations of starlings
overhead.

listening to them we survive
to walk / dorekh
the Path, with kabbalists
R. Chiyya & R. Yose,
the chevraya kadisha
the holy companions,
a derekh through the sea,

away from the energy vampyrism
& relentless phantasmagoric
cyberstalking of
NaziBotQueen,
who engages
in cross-contamination,
when prising his mindfully
plagiarising lips
for a crucifictionist wafer:

a tax-deductible, copyright charity
deduction for ontological delusions
long after midnight,
clutching his cossetted Yehu'di
hatreds like
a perforated osculatorium.

Reb Uri Tzvi Greenberg z"l, 1923 [trans.
Michael Weingrad]:
'For so long there has been no water
in the wells. Only curses. ...& suddenly
the icons scream in Yiddish'.

II.

Light is the absence of Darkness,
to acknowledge Rav Rebecca
Newberger Goldstein.
& the holy slow train moves
(when it does)
sideways across flat earths.

consider the post-Auschwitz dilemma for
an opus dei natz'ri who cannot grasp
the etymology:

prae / before + posterus / coming after
praeposterus / reversed, absurd.

did Shabtai Zisel / 'Bob Dylan' influence the
teachings of R. Yitzhak Luria z"l ?

III.

memories are stalking & ambuscading,
& as you said, Reb David Meltzer z"l,
'the Yehu'di in me is the ghost of me'...

& now the hourglass is invisible...
the windows of perception
to be peered into,
not out of,
as hairline fractures
develop in the retinas of narrow-ruled
yellow writing tablets masquerading
as frenetic mirrors,

never glimpsing tzefiyat ha'yeshu'ah,
the expectation of salvation.

& we are here,
witnessing cyberian corpses
erecting three-way mirrors to their
paedodragonesque mindfulness for girl
children...the mantras of a white supremacist
eunuch sniper trained to effect
genocide at a distance, his audible hungering
for the rapture of an endloesung in his
drive-by dark carnival, having no
farraginous self to say farewell to.

IV.

interlude / הַפסָקָה

Kafka z"l:
'I am divided from all things
by a hollow space'

Shabtai Zisel / 'Bob Dylan':
'I felt that place within, that
hollow place, where martyrs
weep, & angels play with sin'

Rav Yitzhak Luria z"l:
after tzimtzum,
the withdrawal of
'ehyeh 'asher 'ehyeh,
there came to be
halal ha'panui,
'the hollow space'

R. Shabbatai Sheftel ben
Akiva Horowitz z"l, 1719.
Shefa tal [Frankfurt edition]
3.5, 57b [Hebrew]:
'Before the world's bere'shit,
'ayin sof withdrew into its essence,
from itself to itself within itself.
It left halal ha'panui within its
essence, in which it emanated
and created' [emended from
Daniel Matt 1995]

V.

sh'ma...'mir veln zey iberlebn, iberlebn, iberlebn'
(Lublin Chassidim z"l, 1939)...
hear: 'we shall outlive them, outlive them,
outlive them',

the trolls here & what they call 'poetry':
collections of letters in a flickering moon-glow
computer screen behind a suburban curtain,
letters having no glyphs or sounds,
all encased in Sho'ah denial...

and yet. white supremacist sock monkeys
cannot silence the memories of the
thousands of Yehu'dit children z"l
burned alive on pyres, June-August 1944,
in the holy natz'ri village of Auschwitz,
in october country.

לעולם לא עוד לעולם לא עוד

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
...with thanks to my akhim / brothers & poets,
D.J. Carlile & George Dance & Will Dockery
for reading previous drafts...
...and to the memories z"l of David Meltzer 17 February 1937-31 December 2016
& Anthony Scaduto 7 March 1932-12 December 2017...chaver'im / friends
& for 'or from R. Paul Laderman z"l & R. Meyer Goldberg z"l

STEPHAN PICKERING / חפץ ח"ם בן אברהם
Torah אלילה Yehu'di Apikores / Philologia Kabbalistica Speculativa Researcher
לחיות זמן רב ולשגשג...לעולם לא עוד
THE KABBALAH FRACTALS PROJECT
Lord Penis
2018-01-28 18:43:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
I cannot forget...
Snipped the ersatz-jude post from the ersatz-jude himself.
Rachel
2018-01-28 22:16:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lord Penis
Post by Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
I cannot forget...
Snipped the ersatz-jude post from the ersatz-jude himself.
where did the inspiration come from?

did he milk his wang dry then drink the jizzy love juice?

(i'm having a bad day)
h***@gmail.com
2018-01-28 22:21:45 UTC
Permalink
I know the feeling.
Rachel
2018-01-28 22:27:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@gmail.com
I know the feeling.
you drink your jizzy love juice a lot?
h***@gmail.com
2018-01-28 22:30:52 UTC
Permalink
Feel better now?
Rachel
2018-01-28 22:48:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@gmail.com
Feel better now?
well, i'm on conditioner break from the Shower...

it was hot water this time...
h***@gmail.com
2018-01-28 22:49:35 UTC
Permalink
Good to know. Enjoy the rest of your day.
Rachel
2018-01-28 22:53:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@gmail.com
Good to know. Enjoy the rest of your day.
i wish i were dead today.
Rachel
2018-01-28 22:54:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rachel
Post by h***@gmail.com
Good to know. Enjoy the rest of your day.
i wish i were dead today.
too bad nobody wants to come help/support/inspire me.
h***@gmail.com
2018-01-28 22:55:16 UTC
Permalink
I just returned from a viewing.
Rachel
2018-01-28 23:01:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@gmail.com
I just returned from a viewing.
of what?
Rachel
2018-01-28 23:01:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rachel
Post by h***@gmail.com
I just returned from a viewing.
of what?
jesus?
h***@gmail.com
2018-01-28 23:06:16 UTC
Permalink
I'm sorry you feel miserable. Things
will either get better, or they won't.
You'll be dead soon enough anyway,
so there's no reason to worry now.
Rachel
2018-01-28 23:09:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@gmail.com
I'm sorry you feel miserable. Things
will either get better, or they won't.
You'll be dead soon enough anyway,
so there's no reason to worry now.
i wish someone would come over and just kill me now. :-(((
Rachel
2018-01-28 23:17:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rachel
Post by h***@gmail.com
I'm sorry you feel miserable. Things
will either get better, or they won't.
You'll be dead soon enough anyway,
so there's no reason to worry now.
i wish someone would come over and just kill me now. :-(((
well, when all else fails, watch auschwitz, the final solution.
Rachel
2018-01-28 23:21:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by h***@gmail.com
I'm sorry you feel miserable. Things
will either get better, or they won't.
You'll be dead soon enough anyway,
so there's no reason to worry now.
i wish someone would come over and just kill me now. :-(((
well, when all else fails, watch auschwitz, the final solution.
okay, my life isn't THAT bad... :-///
Rachel
2018-01-28 23:23:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by h***@gmail.com
I'm sorry you feel miserable. Things
will either get better, or they won't.
You'll be dead soon enough anyway,
so there's no reason to worry now.
i wish someone would come over and just kill me now. :-(((
well, when all else fails, watch auschwitz, the final solution.
although i wouldn't strenuously object if they came here today and gassed me with carbon monoxide for being jewish and mentally ill.
Rachel
2018-01-29 00:02:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by h***@gmail.com
I'm sorry you feel miserable. Things
will either get better, or they won't.
You'll be dead soon enough anyway,
so there's no reason to worry now.
i wish someone would come over and just kill me now. :-(((
well, when all else fails, watch auschwitz, the final solution.
although i wouldn't strenuously object if they came here today and gassed me with carbon monoxide for being jewish and mentally ill.
WHY DID MY PARENT'S GIVE BIRTH TO ME THIS IS DISGUSTING WHAT WERE THEY THINKING!??!?
Rachel
2018-01-29 00:06:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by h***@gmail.com
I'm sorry you feel miserable. Things
will either get better, or they won't.
You'll be dead soon enough anyway,
so there's no reason to worry now.
i wish someone would come over and just kill me now. :-(((
well, when all else fails, watch auschwitz, the final solution.
although i wouldn't strenuously object if they came here today and gassed me with carbon monoxide for being jewish and mentally ill.
WHY DID MY PARENT'S GIVE BIRTH TO ME THIS IS DISGUSTING WHAT WERE THEY THINKING!??!?
this is so disgusting i want to kill myself.
Rachel
2018-01-29 00:08:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by h***@gmail.com
I'm sorry you feel miserable. Things
will either get better, or they won't.
You'll be dead soon enough anyway,
so there's no reason to worry now.
i wish someone would come over and just kill me now. :-(((
well, when all else fails, watch auschwitz, the final solution.
although i wouldn't strenuously object if they came here today and gassed me with carbon monoxide for being jewish and mentally ill.
WHY DID MY PARENT'S GIVE BIRTH TO ME THIS IS DISGUSTING WHAT WERE THEY THINKING!??!?
this is so disgusting i want to kill myself.
i bet the whole thing is a big joke, ha ha ha, it never happened!
Rachel
2018-01-29 00:11:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by h***@gmail.com
I'm sorry you feel miserable. Things
will either get better, or they won't.
You'll be dead soon enough anyway,
so there's no reason to worry now.
i wish someone would come over and just kill me now. :-(((
well, when all else fails, watch auschwitz, the final solution.
although i wouldn't strenuously object if they came here today and gassed me with carbon monoxide for being jewish and mentally ill.
WHY DID MY PARENT'S GIVE BIRTH TO ME THIS IS DISGUSTING WHAT WERE THEY THINKING!??!?
this is so disgusting i want to kill myself.
i bet the whole thing is a big joke, ha ha ha, it never happened!
i bet if my mom were sophie in sophie's choice, she would have said, "take the girl! take the girl!" lolololol
m***@gmail.com
2018-01-29 00:52:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by Rachel
Post by h***@gmail.com
I'm sorry you feel miserable. Things
will either get better, or they won't.
You'll be dead soon enough anyway,
so there's no reason to worry now.
i wish someone would come over and just kill me now. :-(((
well, when all else fails, watch auschwitz, the final solution.
although i wouldn't strenuously object if they came here today and gassed me with carbon monoxide for being jewish and mentally ill.
WHY DID MY PARENT'S GIVE BIRTH TO ME THIS IS DISGUSTING WHAT WERE THEY THINKING!??!?
this is so disgusting i want to kill myself.
i bet the whole thing is a big joke, ha ha ha, it never happened!

Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
2018-01-29 01:06:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by m***@gmail.com
https://www.youtube.com/watch
Shalom & Erev tov...your white supremacist proaganda (with its echoes of Julius Streicher) is not welcome here.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
STEPHAN PICKERING / חפץ ח"ם בן אברהם
Torah אלילה Yehu'di Apikores / Philologia Kabbalistica Speculativa Researcher
לחיות זמן רב ולשגשג...לעולם לא עוד
THE KABBALAH FRACTALS PROJECT
ME
2018-01-29 01:11:48 UTC
Permalink
Thank you, thank you very much.............
Will Dockery
2018-01-29 05:40:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rachel
this is so disgusting i want to kill myself.
You seem to be having a very rough night, Rachel... I don't know, perhaps you should take your meds and try to rest some?
Will Dockery
2018-02-03 02:30:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@gmail.com
Good to know. Enjoy the rest of your day.
And likewise to you, my friend.

:)
Will Dockery
2018-02-03 02:30:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@gmail.com
Feel better now?
Not bad, that sirloin steak with baked potato definitely charged me up.

:)
Rachel
2018-02-03 02:39:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
Post by h***@gmail.com
Feel better now?
Not bad, that sirloin steak with baked potato definitely charged me up.
:)
another $50 bucks from drive-by down the hatch?
Will Dockery
2018-02-03 02:22:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@gmail.com
I know the feeling.
About not forgetting?
Will Dockery
2018-02-01 12:08:57 UTC
Permalink
Okay, Travis, I appreciate your explanation...

Knowing that it's a personal dislike you have for Stephan rather than based on his religious beliefs is somewhat better than how it looked at first, where I was worried you might be another Anti-Semite racist type.

You know how common those types are around our town.
Trav
2018-02-01 15:24:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
Okay, Travis, I appreciate your explanation...
Knowing that it's a personal dislike you have for Stephan rather than based on his religious beliefs is somewhat better than how it looked at first, where I was worried you might be another Anti-Semite racist type.
You know how common those types are around our town.
I assure you, Will, I'm the last person who has any room to make judgments of others based on heritage or lifestyle choices. Lightning would strike out of clear skies to smite me down if I made such judgments of those after the roads upon which I have tread.
Will Dockery
2018-01-28 18:52:35 UTC
Permalink
Enjoying viewing the evolution of this poem in "real time", Stephan.

😀
Will Dockery
2018-01-28 21:44:31 UTC
Permalink
I just read this poem again, and it it pure, and quite splendid, poetry.
Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
2018-01-28 22:23:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
I just read this poem again, and it it pure, and quite splendid, poetry.
Shalom & Erev tov, Will...todah / gratitude...As the magician sang on 29 July 1965, 'The fortunetelling lady has even taken all her things inside'.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
STEPHAN PICKERING / חפץ ח"ם בן אברהם
Torah אלילה Yehu'di Apikores / Philologia Kabbalistica Speculativa Researcher
לחיות זמן רב ולשגשג...לעולם לא עוד
THE KABBALAH FRACTALS PROJECT
Lord Penis
2018-01-28 22:31:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
Post by Will Dockery
I just read this poem again, and it it pure, and quite splendid, poetry.
Shalom & Erev tov, Will...todah / gratitude...As the magician sang on 29 July 1965, 'The fortunetelling lady has even taken all her things inside'.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Look at the two lovebirds cooing at each other.

Dockery must have just burped Pickering's worm.
Will Dockery
2018-01-28 22:35:34 UTC
Permalink
"I had to rearrange their faces and give them all another name..."

😀
Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
2018-01-29 16:28:28 UTC
Permalink
On Sunday, January 28, 2018 at 10:41:09 AM UTC-8, Chafetz Chayim benAvraham wrote:

Shalom & Boker tov...the sho'ah denial censorship of the 'sampler', the new 'moderator' being one of the most vicious trolls (who never writes), the former 'moderator' remaining a cyberstalker -- I am not surprised.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
STEPHAN PICKERING / חפץ ח"ם בן אברהם
Torah אלילה Yehu'di Apikores / Philologia Kabbalistica Speculativa Researcher
לחיות זמן רב ולשגשג...לעולם לא עוד
THE KABBALAH FRACTALS PROJECT
Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
2018-02-01 01:46:56 UTC
Permalink
31 January 2018...5:38 PM (4 minutes ago)

to me from D.J. Carlile, Rimbaud scholar/translator

Stephan; Heavvvy duty, my friend. And XLNT. Thank you for sending this to me.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
STEPHAN PICKERING / חפץ ח"ם בן אברהם
Torah אלילה Yehu'di Apikores / Philologia Kabbalistica Speculativa Researcher
לחיות זמן רב ולשגשג...לע�
Will Dockery
2018-02-01 04:30:17 UTC
Permalink
Interesting... and agreed, your poem is a grand mini epic.
Trav
2018-02-01 05:02:51 UTC
Permalink
still not actually jewish though
Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
2018-02-01 05:06:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Trav
still not actually jewish though
Shalom & Erev tov, Travis...your sentence is bullshit. I am a Yehu'di, the word is Yehu'dit, and my creation is 'actually' Yehu'dit. You are not.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
STEPHAN PICKERING / חפץ ח"ם בן אברהם
Torah אלילה Yehu'di Apikores / Philologia Kabbalistica Speculativa Researcher
לחיות זמן רב ולשגשג...לעולם לא עוד
THE KABBALAH FRACTALS PROJECT
Trav
2018-02-01 05:14:16 UTC
Permalink
nuh uh, I got more jew in my earlobes than you got in your whole body
Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
2018-02-01 05:16:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Trav
nuh uh, I got more jew in my earlobes than you got in your whole body
Travis...go lie somewhere else.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
STEPHAN PICKERING / חפץ ח"ם בן אברהם
Torah אלילה Yehu'di Apikores / Philologia Kabbalistica Speculativa Researcher
לחיות זמן רב ולשגשג...לעולם לא
Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
2018-02-01 05:22:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Trav
nuh uh, I got more jew in my earlobes than you got in your whole body
I go even further to correct your bullshit. PM your full name and address, and I'll send you a document, in Hebrew, signed by three Orthodox rabbis almost 50 years ago (and recognised by the Charedi rabbinic courts in Yisra'el), proving I am a Yehu'di. In turn, you can apologise to me here, in public. I grow weary of your smarmy mouth.+

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
STEPHAN PICKERING / חפץ ח"ם בן אברהם
Torah אלילה Yehu'di Apikores / Philologia Kabbalistica Speculativa Researcher
לחיות זמן רב ולשגשג...לעולם לא עוד
THE KABBALAH FRACTALS PROJECT
Trav
2018-02-01 05:32:53 UTC
Permalink
Travis McCrackin
3404 14th ave Apt B
Columbus GA, 31904

bring on your proof
Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
2018-02-01 05:47:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Trav
Travis McCrackin
3404 14th ave Apt B
Columbus GA, 31904
bring on your proof
Shalom & Erev tov...it will be mailed within 1 week.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
STEPHAN PICKERING / חפץ ח"ם בן אברהם
Torah אלילה Yehu'di Apikores / Philologia Kabbalistica Speculativa Researcher
לחיות זמן רב ולשגשג...לעולם לא עוד
THE KABBALAH FRACTALS PROJECT
Trav
2018-02-01 06:52:18 UTC
Permalink
Apologize he says! Ha! I do, however, look forward to your proof, though I doubt it will arrive. My smarmy mouth huh? I grow tired of your failure to contribute here in any meaningful way. Your failure to take criticism in any form. Your attempt to hide behind religion and ideology, and to hurl accusations of antisemitism at anyone who disagrees with you. Easily half of all the bullshit drama that flies around this place has you at its center. Finally I'm tired of you being a whiny cunt. And this isn't the first online community you've turned against yourself. Eventually, Stephanie, you'd think you realized that if you were regularly disliked, criticized, and ostracized by most that it may not be everyone else with the problem, but it seems you'll die thinking the world owed you more. Hey, you might be jewish after all.
u***@gmail.com
2018-02-01 08:33:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Trav
Apologize he says! Ha! I do, however, look forward to your proof, though I doubt it will arrive. My smarmy mouth huh? I grow tired of your failure to contribute here in any meaningful way. Your failure to take criticism in any form. Your attempt to hide behind religion and ideology, and to hurl accusations of antisemitism at anyone who disagrees with you. Easily half of all the bullshit drama that flies around this place has you at its center. Finally I'm tired of you being a whiny cunt. And this isn't the first online community you've turned against yourself. Eventually, Stephanie, you'd think you realized that if you were regularly disliked, criticized, and ostracized by most that it may not be everyone else with the problem, but it seems you'll die thinking the world owed you more. Hey, you might be jewish after all.
He's just a robot, repeating his stupid little Jew cult tirades over and over. Stephen Robotowitz should be his new name. Next, he will be calling you a fascist, a Nazi, and any of his usual canned words. Will Dockery's head has been up this guy's ass for decades, and I see he already jumped to Robotowitz's aid. they are both really fucked up pieces of work, let me tell you.
Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
2018-02-01 16:15:22 UTC
Permalink
On Wednesday, January 31, 2018 at 10:52:19 PM UTC-8, Trav wrote:


Shalom & Erev tov, Will...as a courtesy, I am sending you the photocopy of the document proving I am a Yehu'di. We have discussed this privately.There is no such category as 'Jewish blood', nor is there a 'Jewish' race. I have known Yehu'dim from Egypt, southern Africa, Iran, China, Europe -- all of whom are different biological races, but all Yehu'dim. I have nothing further to say about this surprisingly racist, lying screed, and nothing more to Travis.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
STEPHAN PICKERING / חפץ ח"ם בן אברהם
Torah אלילה Yehu'di Apikores / Philologia Kabbalistica Speculativa Researcher
לחיות זמן רב ולשגשג...לעולם לא עוד
THE KABBALAH FRACTALS PROJECT
Rachel
2018-02-01 16:17:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
Shalom & Erev tov, Will...as a courtesy, I am sending you the photocopy of the document proving I am a Yehu'di. We have discussed this privately.There is no such category as 'Jewish blood', nor is there a 'Jewish' race. I have known Yehu'dim from Egypt, southern Africa, Iran, China, Europe -- all of whom are different biological races, but all Yehu'dim. I have nothing further to say about this surprisingly racist, lying screed, and nothing more to Travis.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
STEPHAN PICKERING / חפץ ח"ם בן אברהם
Torah אלילה Yehu'di Apikores / Philologia Kabbalistica Speculativa Researcher
לחיות זמן רב ולשגשג...לעולם לא עוד
THE KABBALAH FRACTALS PROJECT
can dogs be jewish ?
George J. Dance
2018-02-01 16:21:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rachel
can dogs be jewish ?
Would you try to give your dog a bris?
Rachel
2018-02-01 16:37:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rachel
can dogs be jewish ?
Would you try to give your dog a bris?
she was born kosher
George J. Dance
2018-02-01 16:50:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rachel
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rachel
can dogs be jewish ?
Would you try to give your dog a bris?
she was born kosher
No, no, no: do not put it that way. "Kosher" refers to food.

Have you ever read the poem by Christopher Smart about his cat's religion?
Rachel
2018-02-01 17:07:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rachel
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rachel
can dogs be jewish ?
Would you try to give your dog a bris?
she was born kosher
No, no, no: do not put it that way. "Kosher" refers to food.
Have you ever read the poem by Christopher Smart about his cat's religion?
then why do things like household cleaning products and toothpaste have to be certified by rabbis as being kosher, too?

they aren't food, in any traditional sense of the word.

well, we all have our own definitions of food, anyway.

some cats wouldn't even know a lasagna if it came up and bit them on the tuchus.

i purposely don't read any poems other than those by bob dylan, drive-by, and richard oaktree, as i do not want to be unduly influenced by mediocrity and inferiority.
George J. Dance
2018-02-01 17:18:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rachel
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rachel
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rachel
can dogs be jewish ?
Would you try to give your dog a bris?
she was born kosher
No, no, no: do not put it that way. "Kosher" refers to food.
Have you ever read the poem by Christopher Smart about his cat's religion?
then why do things like household cleaning products and toothpaste have to be certified by rabbis as being kosher, too?
Point well taken. Toothpaste and mouthwash go into your body. Cleaning products? I guess because they leave a residue that one touches, even eats off of. I'd have to ask a rabbi, though; I'm just speculating.
Post by Rachel
they aren't food, in any traditional sense of the word.
well, we all have our own definitions of food, anyway.
some cats wouldn't even know a lasagna if it came up and bit them on the tuchus.
i purposely don't read any poems other than those by bob dylan, drive-by, and richard oaktree, as i do not want to be unduly influenced by mediocrity and inferiority.
OK; but the poems I recommend (both here and on my blog) have nothing to do with mediocrity and inferiority. Smart's poem is *great*.
Rachel
2018-02-01 17:24:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rachel
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rachel
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rachel
can dogs be jewish ?
Would you try to give your dog a bris?
she was born kosher
No, no, no: do not put it that way. "Kosher" refers to food.
Have you ever read the poem by Christopher Smart about his cat's religion?
then why do things like household cleaning products and toothpaste have to be certified by rabbis as being kosher, too?
Point well taken. Toothpaste and mouthwash go into your body. Cleaning products? I guess because they leave a residue that one touches, even eats off of. I'd have to ask a rabbi, though; I'm just speculating.
ahh...so if you *touch* an unkosher cleaning product, then you have violated the laws of kashrut, and perhaps need to head to the nearest mikvah?
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rachel
they aren't food, in any traditional sense of the word.
well, we all have our own definitions of food, anyway.
some cats wouldn't even know a lasagna if it came up and bit them on the tuchus.
i purposely don't read any poems other than those by bob dylan, drive-by, and richard oaktree, as i do not want to be unduly influenced by mediocrity and inferiority.
OK; but the poems I recommend (both here and on my blog) have nothing to do with mediocrity and inferiority. Smart's poem is *great*.
well, you are entitled to your asshole, as i am entitled to mine. ;-)
Will Dockery
2018-02-01 17:28:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rachel
i purposely don't read any poems other than those by bob dylan, drive-by, and richard oaktree
Great, you seem to have picked a side... if only they'll allow you to join.

:)
Will Dockery
2018-02-01 06:06:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Trav
still not actually jewish though
I don't get involved in discussions of politics or religion, or try not to, but in the 40+ years I've known Pickering, his religious belief never seems to be questionable until now, coming from posters in this poetry group.

https://www.amazon.com/Bob-Dylan-approximately-portrait-Midrash/dp/0679504931

Bob Dylan approximately: A portrait of the Jewish poet in search of God : a Midrash Hardcover – 1975
by Stephan Pickering

A portrait of the Jewish poet in search of God: a Midrash.

Published by David McKay Company, New York. Hardback, 204 pages. A blow by blow account of a Bob Dylan’s 1974 concert tour.
Trav
2018-02-01 06:34:12 UTC
Permalink
i didn't say he wasn't a published author
Trav
2018-02-01 06:37:02 UTC
Permalink
furthermore Judaism requires more than religious belief, it requires one to be of jewish blood.
Will Dockery
2018-02-01 08:35:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Trav
furthermore Judaism requires more than religious belief, it requires one to be of jewish blood.
Travis, I loathe arguing religion or politics, but I mainly wondered about your reasoning for the sudden attack on Stephan Pickering, why the disrespect for his religious belief?
Trav
2018-02-01 09:27:22 UTC
Permalink
Will I have no disrespect for anyone's religious beliefs, this is not about religion, that's just the easiest way to get under his skin. This isn't sudden. I've maintained that he doesn't belong here since my first few days on. A lot of what he posts isn't poetry. He's a shit starter, and I'm giving a little back... do we have to bring up nambla again? Will I know he's your friend, but some friends aren't meant for some places. For instance, I can't work with most of my friends if we wish to continue cordial relationships, I wouldn't take a metal fan to a Belle & Sebastian concert. He should not be here. That is the opinion of everyone excepting you and George, and there are some days even he wishes him gone. That is a large majority. If it were closer to an even split that would be a different story. Half of the shit YOU get here is on his behalf... Come on, there's taking up for the underdog, and then there's taking up for the underdog that bites passersby legs and continually hides behind you for protection.... sometimes it gets you beat up unnecessarily.
George J. Dance
2018-02-01 14:42:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Trav
Will I have no disrespect for anyone's religious beliefs, this is not about religion, that's just the easiest way to get under his skin.
Thanks for the candor - sincerely. I think most of the people using the 'fake Jew' meme would say the very same thing, if they were honest.

This isn't sudden. I've maintained that he doesn't belong here since my first few days on. A lot of what he posts isn't poetry.

A lot of what most of the people post isn't poetry. The few who I do see posting only poetry, I don't see posting very often.
Post by Trav
He's a shit starter, and I'm giving a little back...
As Jesus (a great guy to bring up on a "Jewish" thread, right?) realized years ago, the big problem in this world isn't so much bad people doing shit, but good people doing shit 'back'. Did you ever consider that his shit stirring began by doing it 'back' to people, too?
Post by Trav
do we have to bring up nambla again?
Who brings up NAMBLA? Seriously? I talk about it only when someone else brings it up first; afaics, that's the only time he mentions it, too. So, seriously, who brings it up; and why?
Post by Trav
Will I know he's your friend, but some friends aren't meant for some places. For instance, I can't work with most of my friends if we wish to continue cordial relationships, I wouldn't take a metal fan to a Belle & Sebastian concert. He should not be here.
As you realize, this is a 'place' - a community. People in a community are not friends; they're neighbors. They first have to learn to live as neighbors, and then as good neighbors, and friendship may evolve.
Post by Trav
That is the opinion of everyone excepting you and George, and there are some days even he wishes him gone.
I'm not a fan of Stephan's recent posting style. I compare it to a celebrated poster we used to have here called 'Vera', who fought with everyone (but one friend of hers). She and I used to fight, too, until the friend explained her problem, in 4 words. I'll put them on another line, since they were so important to my understanding:

"Vera is punch drunk."

I'll ask you to take that in.
Post by Trav
That is a large majority. If it were closer to an even split that would be a different story.
Perhaps, if everyone had to take a side, they'd opt for the 2 I've called the Liar Twins. However, I suspect that most of the people here don't want to take sides. (I only got slotted onto a side because I didn't want to take one.)
Post by Trav
Half of the shit YOU get here is on his behalf...
You've got that backwards. Much more than half the shit Stephan gets here these days is from the 2 anti-Will trolls (not the Liar Twins, who both have their fake killfiles up), who'd be spreading their shit in any case.
Post by Trav
Come on, there's taking up for the underdog, and then there's taking up for the underdog that bites passersby legs and continually hides behind you for protection.... sometimes it gets you beat up unnecessarily.
In real life, if you had such a thing going on - say a gang of kids in a school constantly fighting with one - how would you look at the problem?
Trav
2018-02-01 15:46:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Trav
Will I have no disrespect for anyone's religious beliefs, this is not about religion, that's just the easiest way to get under his skin.
Thanks for the candor - sincerely. I think most of the people using the 'fake Jew' meme would say the very same thing, if they were honest.
This isn't sudden. I've maintained that he doesn't belong here since my first few days on. A lot of what he posts isn't poetry.
A lot of what most of the people post isn't poetry. The few who I do see posting only poetry, I don't see posting very often.
Post by Trav
He's a shit starter, and I'm giving a little back...
As Jesus (a great guy to bring up on a "Jewish" thread, right?) realized years ago, the big problem in this world isn't so much bad people doing shit, but good people doing shit 'back'. Did you ever consider that his shit stirring began by doing it 'back' to people, too?
Post by Trav
do we have to bring up nambla again?
Who brings up NAMBLA? Seriously? I talk about it only when someone else brings it up first; afaics, that's the only time he mentions it, too. So, seriously, who brings it up; and why?
Post by Trav
Will I know he's your friend, but some friends aren't meant for some places. For instance, I can't work with most of my friends if we wish to continue cordial relationships, I wouldn't take a metal fan to a Belle & Sebastian concert. He should not be here.
As you realize, this is a 'place' - a community. People in a community are not friends; they're neighbors. They first have to learn to live as neighbors, and then as good neighbors, and friendship may evolve.
Post by Trav
That is the opinion of everyone excepting you and George, and there are some days even he wishes him gone.
"Vera is punch drunk."
I'll ask you to take that in.
Post by Trav
That is a large majority. If it were closer to an even split that would be a different story.
Perhaps, if everyone had to take a side, they'd opt for the 2 I've called the Liar Twins. However, I suspect that most of the people here don't want to take sides. (I only got slotted onto a side because I didn't want to take one.)
Post by Trav
Half of the shit YOU get here is on his behalf...
You've got that backwards. Much more than half the shit Stephan gets here these days is from the 2 anti-Will trolls (not the Liar Twins, who both have their fake killfiles up), who'd be spreading their shit in any case.
Post by Trav
Come on, there's taking up for the underdog, and then there's taking up for the underdog that bites passersby legs and continually hides behind you for protection.... sometimes it gets you beat up unnecessarily.
In real life, if you had such a thing going on - say a gang of kids in a school constantly fighting with one - how would you look at the problem?
I like you George, you know that, right? And while I appreciate you taking the time to respond to my rant point by point. MANY OF WHICH HAD MORE THAN A LITTLE VALIDITY TO THEM (I wasn't yelling at you George that was an aside to everyone)..... I also realize it's nothing personal. You could even get mean if you want, i'll be alright. I'm only going to respond to the last one though. As a child, I was quiet till 5th grade, long story short something happened that year that made me feel empowered, I spent much longer than necessary poking at people for fun, people not quite as smart usually, and physical retribution was really their only outlet, but I was pretty smart with it. Any time anything was brought to the attention of teachers, who do you think got in trouble? Me? Nope. The other person. And to this day i've never had the ass beating I very dearly deserve for some things I've done and some I still do. I'm not advocating violence here, unless it pertains to myself, but maybe, had I received such a thing a time or two, my first years of high-school definitely would have gone more smoothly, and I may not (I believe definitely would not) have developed some of the habits I still have.
George J. Dance
2018-02-01 16:19:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Trav
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Trav
Will I have no disrespect for anyone's religious beliefs, this is not about religion, that's just the easiest way to get under his skin.
Thanks for the candor - sincerely. I think most of the people using the 'fake Jew' meme would say the very same thing, if they were honest.
This isn't sudden. I've maintained that he doesn't belong here since my first few days on. A lot of what he posts isn't poetry.
A lot of what most of the people post isn't poetry. The few who I do see posting only poetry, I don't see posting very often.
Post by Trav
He's a shit starter, and I'm giving a little back...
As Jesus (a great guy to bring up on a "Jewish" thread, right?) realized years ago, the big problem in this world isn't so much bad people doing shit, but good people doing shit 'back'. Did you ever consider that his shit stirring began by doing it 'back' to people, too?
Post by Trav
do we have to bring up nambla again?
Who brings up NAMBLA? Seriously? I talk about it only when someone else brings it up first; afaics, that's the only time he mentions it, too. So, seriously, who brings it up; and why?
Post by Trav
Will I know he's your friend, but some friends aren't meant for some places. For instance, I can't work with most of my friends if we wish to continue cordial relationships, I wouldn't take a metal fan to a Belle & Sebastian concert. He should not be here.
As you realize, this is a 'place' - a community. People in a community are not friends; they're neighbors. They first have to learn to live as neighbors, and then as good neighbors, and friendship may evolve.
Post by Trav
That is the opinion of everyone excepting you and George, and there are some days even he wishes him gone.
"Vera is punch drunk."
I'll ask you to take that in.
Post by Trav
That is a large majority. If it were closer to an even split that would be a different story.
Perhaps, if everyone had to take a side, they'd opt for the 2 I've called the Liar Twins. However, I suspect that most of the people here don't want to take sides. (I only got slotted onto a side because I didn't want to take one.)
Post by Trav
Half of the shit YOU get here is on his behalf...
You've got that backwards. Much more than half the shit Stephan gets here these days is from the 2 anti-Will trolls (not the Liar Twins, who both have their fake killfiles up), who'd be spreading their shit in any case.
Post by Trav
Come on, there's taking up for the underdog, and then there's taking up for the underdog that bites passersby legs and continually hides behind you for protection.... sometimes it gets you beat up unnecessarily.
In real life, if you had such a thing going on - say a gang of kids in a school constantly fighting with one - how would you look at the problem?
I like you George, you know that, right?
Thank you. I like you too. As I've said, in my view we're 'neighbors,' and I want to be a good one.
Post by Trav
And while I appreciate you taking the time to respond to my rant point by point. MANY OF WHICH HAD MORE THAN A LITTLE VALIDITY TO THEM (I wasn't yelling at you George that was an aside to everyone)..... I also realize it's nothing personal. You could even get mean if you want, i'll be alright.
I don't want to get mean, because then you'll only stop listening to/reading me; I'll be "dead to you". What's the good of that? I won't even say your viewpoint's wrong; I only want you to understand mine.
Post by Trav
I'm only going to respond to the last one though. As a child, I was quiet till 5th grade, long story short something happened that year that made me feel empowered, I spent much longer than necessary poking at people for fun, people not quite as smart usually, and physical retribution was really their only outlet, but I was pretty smart with it. Any time anything was brought to the attention of teachers, who do you think got in trouble? Me? Nope. The other person. And to this day i've never had the ass beating I very dearly deserve for some things I've done and some I still do.
You were a "bully"? I, OTOH, was bullied; which is probably why I identify with the "Veras". I've got to say that the above sounds like our Mr. "Pendragon" - and I do think he deserves an ass beating sometimes!
Post by Trav
I'm not advocating violence here, unless it pertains to myself, but maybe, had I received such a thing a time or two, my first years of high-school definitely would have gone more smoothly, and I may not (I believe definitely would not) have developed some of the habits I still have.
I dunno about that. When I got a bit older, I began to realize that the worst bullies in school were those getting frequent ass beatings at home. But that's way off-topic, so I'll stop there.
Will Dockery
2018-02-01 18:18:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Trav
Will I have no disrespect for anyone's religious beliefs, this is not about religion, that's just the easiest way to get under his skin.
Thanks for the candor - sincerely. I think most of the people using the 'fake Jew' meme would say the very same thing, if they were honest.
This isn't sudden. I've maintained that he doesn't belong here since my first few days on. A lot of what he posts isn't poetry.
A lot of what most of the people post isn't poetry. The few who I do see posting only poetry, I don't see posting very often.
Post by Trav
He's a shit starter, and I'm giving a little back...
As Jesus (a great guy to bring up on a "Jewish" thread, right?) realized years ago, the big problem in this world isn't so much bad people doing shit, but good people doing shit 'back'. Did you ever consider that his shit stirring began by doing it 'back' to people, too?
Post by Trav
do we have to bring up nambla again?
Who brings up NAMBLA? Seriously? I talk about it only when someone else brings it up first; afaics, that's the only time he mentions it, too. So, seriously, who brings it up; and why?
Post by Trav
Will I know he's your friend, but some friends aren't meant for some places. For instance, I can't work with most of my friends if we wish to continue cordial relationships, I wouldn't take a metal fan to a Belle & Sebastian concert. He should not be here.
As you realize, this is a 'place' - a community. People in a community are not friends; they're neighbors. They first have to learn to live as neighbors, and then as good neighbors, and friendship may evolve.
Post by Trav
That is the opinion of everyone excepting you and George, and there are some days even he wishes him gone.
"Vera is punch drunk."
I'll ask you to take that in.
To that, I say read Muhammad Ali's poetry, start with "Rope-A-Dope" and then follow up with a good "Russian Tank".

Deflect those blows... I always find it amusing when the trolls try to use the use of deflection as an insult.

http://www.wbur.org/hereandnow/2016/06/10/muhammad-ali-poetry
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Trav
That is a large majority. If it were closer to an even split that would be a different story.
Perhaps, if everyone had to take a side, they'd opt for the 2 I've called the Liar Twins. However, I suspect that most of the people here don't want to take sides. (I only got slotted onto a side because I didn't want to take one.)
Post by Trav
Half of the shit YOU get here is on his behalf...
You've got that backwards. Much more than half the shit Stephan gets here these days is from the 2 anti-Will trolls (not the Liar Twins, who both have their fake killfiles up), who'd be spreading their shit in any case.
Post by Trav
Come on, there's taking up for the underdog, and then there's taking up for the underdog that bites passersby legs and continually hides behind you for protection.... sometimes it gets you beat up unnecessarily.
In real life, if you had such a thing going on - say a gang of kids in a school constantly fighting with one - how would you look at the problem?
A good read, both of you.

:)
u***@gmail.com
2018-02-02 08:49:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
Post by Trav
furthermore Judaism requires more than religious belief, it requires one to be of jewish blood.
Travis, I loathe arguing religion or politics, but I mainly wondered about your reasoning for the sudden attack on Stephan Pickering, why the disrespect for his religious belief?
Go on and suck Pickering's little cock more, won't you fanboi?
Will Dockery
2018-02-02 11:08:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by u***@gmail.com
suck Pickering's
cock
Your gay fantasy is noted.

:)
u***@gmail.com
2018-02-03 07:48:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by u***@gmail.com
suck Pickering's
cock
My gay fantasy is noted.
Yes, it is.
Lord Penis
2018-02-02 11:11:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by u***@gmail.com
Post by Will Dockery
Post by Trav
furthermore Judaism requires more than religious belief, it requires one to be of jewish blood.
Travis, I loathe arguing religion or politics, but I mainly wondered about your reasoning for the sudden attack on Stephan Pickering, why the disrespect for his religious belief?
Go on and suck Pickering's little cock more, won't you fanboi?
Dockery swallows a lot of Pickering's loads on Friday before shabbos begins.
Will Dockery
2018-02-02 11:17:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
Dockery
Obsess much, fool?

Here, slobber over this, since you can't get "Will Dockery" out of your head:



Twilight Girl, written by Will Dockery & Henry Conley, from the CD Shadowville Speedway. © 2009 Library of Congress Registration Number / Date: PAu003501816 / 2008-09-23
u***@gmail.com
2018-02-03 07:49:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
Post by Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
Dockery
Obsess much, fool?
http://youtu.be/BYETTK16jQI
Twilight Girl, written by Will Dockery & Henry Conley, from the CD Shadowville Speedway. © 2009 Library of Congress Registration Number / Date: PAu003501816 / 2008-09-23
And be sure to downrate it for the garbage that it is.
George J. Dance
2018-02-01 14:15:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Trav
furthermore Judaism requires more than religious belief, it requires one to be of jewish blood.
Definitely the word "Jew" is ambiguous, because it can refer to both ethnicity and religion.

But 'blood' is a bit strong; it's more a matter of 'community'. The Jewish religion has always accepted individual converts.

Indeed, the person who began the 'fake Jew' meme here was a convert himself.
u***@gmail.com
2018-02-01 08:29:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
Post by Trav
still not actually jewish though
I don't get involved in discussions of politics or religion, or try not to, but in the 40+ years I've known Pickering, his religious belief never seems to be questionable until now, coming from posters in this poetry group.
https://www.amazon.com/Bob-Dylan-approximately-portrait-Midrash/dp/0679504931
Bob Dylan approximately: A portrait of the Jewish poet in search of God : a Midrash Hardcover – 1975
by Stephan Pickering
A portrait of the Jewish poet in search of God: a Midrash.
Published by David McKay Company, New York. Hardback, 204 pages. A blow by blow account of a Bob Dylan’s 1974 concert tour.
So what, he wrote some shitty little book on Dylan while he was a tour rat for one tour. It's not even a good book, with three reviews on Amazone, all bad and the pages not even worthy of wiping my ass with. Seems the readers picked up he was a cultic Jew with wacky beliefs:

"Definitely one for the affiacondo. Needless to add, the thesis is based on Dylan/Zimmerman's Jewishness, which is incontestable. How much his immersion in its outlook translates into his work is, of course, contestable, be it intutitive or conscious. Pickering insists on its informing base. It would greatly help if you had a briefing in Hasaidic lore, which I don't, nor was encouraged to by reading Pickering's text. Still, it puts a whole new light on Dylan's musings and made me listen differently to,'John Wesley Harding' for instance. The blurry black and white photos were worth the price of the magazine, back then and its now a certifiable collector/completist's item."

"I had to add a few comments after reading the other review from 1999. I bought this book just after it came out. While I was open to Mr. Pickering's opinions about the importance of the Judaism on Dylan's work, I was put off by his condescension. In fact, I often felt he was using Dylan to make arrogant remarks about issues important to him rather than to Dylan or his fans.
On the other hand, I loved the pictures; most are b&w. Most are from the 1974 tour, but included are earlier photos, some rare photos of the benefit concert Dylan did with Phil Ochs, even a high school photo. There are some reprints of articles by better writers. It's worth a look if Dylan is of particular interest to you."

"I expected commentary on Dylan's lyrics from a Jewish perspective; there is certainly plenty to say on the issue. Unfortunately, this book offered only a blow by blow of a Dylan concert tour, interspersed with drawings of Ein Sof and random quotes from the Kabalah, Elie Wiesel, and Walt Whitman of all people. Great if you want to know every detail of a Dylan tour; otherwise not much use."
Will Dockery
2018-02-01 05:24:23 UTC
Permalink
What are you basing these judgements on, Travis?
Will Dockery
2018-02-01 16:46:42 UTC
Permalink
You seem like a nice guy, Travis, and as you know I really enjoy your songs and poems, but the "fake Jew" taunting and the "get over it" stance to those who write of such thins as the Holocaust (do you tell black folks to get over their anger over the history of slavery, also) is a bit of a red flag to me, who grew up with good old boys, nice as they can be, but viciously racist, and quick to shun those not their kind, such as Yankees and... Jews.

That just doesn't fit your style, knowing you in real life, which is why it is surprising to see you take the right wing tone here on the internet.

That's my perspective, how it looks from here.
George J. Dance
2018-02-01 16:57:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
You seem like a nice guy, Travis, and as you know I really enjoy your songs and poems, but the "fake Jew" taunting and the "get over it" stance to those who write of such thins as the Holocaust (do you tell black folks to get over their anger over the history of slavery, also) is a bit of a red flag to me
Hmmm ... I was just thinking of this, when I was reading the review on Eli Mandel that I just sent Stephan, and this paragraph in particular:

"Born in 1922, raised as a Jew in small-town Saskatchewan, a job working for a pharmacist landed him a stint in the Army Medical Corps during World War Two. It would appear that Mandel came home from the war a permanently scarred man—a man destined to become for the rest of his life what was then called (derogatively) a "D.P.," a Displaced Person. Neither in childhood nor in adult life would he ever to be able to feel a sense of belonging, a sense of living at home among neighbours in a community."
http://canadianpoetry.org/volumes/vol49/kizuk.html

A pretty extreme reaction, but I'm sure lots of people (not just Jews) were scarred by that in their own way.

Now, a lot of people might think (and to be charitable, I'd say this is where Travis is coming from): "Yeah, sure, but Mandel experienced it. Hardly any Jews alive today did; why can't they just forget it and move on?"

To which I imagine the Jewish elder to say: "No, no: move on, but never forget. We don't forget slavery in Egypt; we don't forget exile in Babylon; and we shouldn't forget this, either."








, who grew up with good old boys, nice as they can be, but viciously racist, and quick to shun those not their kind, such as Yankees and... Jews.
Post by Will Dockery
That just doesn't fit your style, knowing you in real life, which is why it is surprising to see you take the right wing tone here on the internet.
That's my perspective, how it looks from here.
Trav
2018-02-01 18:18:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
You seem like a nice guy, Travis, and as you know I really enjoy your songs and poems, but the "fake Jew" taunting and the "get over it" stance to those who write of such thins as the Holocaust (do you tell black folks to get over their anger over the history of slavery, also) is a bit of a red flag to me, who grew up with good old boys, nice as they can be, but viciously racist, and quick to shun those not their kind, such as Yankees and... Jews.
That just doesn't fit your style, knowing you in real life, which is why it is surprising to see you take the right wing tone here on the internet.
That's my perspective, how it looks from here.
Will, the thing most people fail to understand about racism is that it derives the vast majority of its power from those offended by it. When you argue with racism you validate it. Why should anyone care what someone who judges people on race thinks? We should laugh at them, not tighten our assholes, and get all PC, that's what they want. The world polarizes and those of us left in the middle take the heat from both sides while wondering among ourselves at the willfully blind people we used to know as reasonable. So in short will yes, I both believe wholeheartedly in white privilege, seen it often because i've lived in the ghetto, on the wrong side of macon road,where I was known as the crazy white boy on julia avenue, and I told many a black soul there the truths that I knew. When one truly isn't racist "offensive" words sound different. The best thing one can do with wrongs past, whether it happened to you, dad, or grandad, is to let it be a memory, pass on the lesson objectively. Hate has no place here. I laugh at its clumsy attempts at breaking in, but do I respond in kind? No, I smile and put it out of mind, effectively rendering the pitiful thing blind. Racism is as prevalent as your generation likes to make it. I'll give you a for instance and then I'll quit it. I saw a friday or two gone a white man sing chefs chocolate salty balls, unapologetically he walked onto the stage, but neither was there one speck of derision nor hate, and the crowd to which he sang was largely old black women, if you think they cared they didn't, the only ones offended were white kids younger than me, they laughed along, asked him where that song was from when he was done. one might even say it made their night, it was a birthday group. we took shots with them too, and laughed the night away without the fear of saying something wrong in the right way.
Will Dockery
2018-02-03 02:41:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
You seem like a nice guy, Travis, and as you know I really enjoy your
songs and poems, but the "fake Jew" taunting and the "get over it" stance
to those who write of such thins as the Holocaust (do you tell black folks
to get over their anger over the history of slavery, also) is a bit of a
red flag to me, who grew up with good old boys, nice as they can be, but
viciously racist, and quick to shun those not their kind, such as Yankees
and... Jews.
That just doesn't fit your style, knowing you in real life, which is why
it is surprising to see you take the right wing tone here on the internet.
That's my perspective, how it looks from here.
Will, the thing most people fail to understand about racism is that it
derives the vast majority of its power from those offended by it. When you
argue with racism you validate it. Why should anyone care what someone who
judges people on race thinks? We should laugh at them, not tighten our
assholes, and get all PC, that's what they want. The world polarizes and
those of us left in the middle take the heat from both sides while wondering
among ourselves at the willfully blind people we used to know as reasonable.
So in short will yes, I both believe wholeheartedly in white privilege, seen
it often because i've lived in the ghetto, on the wrong side of macon
road,where I was known as the crazy white boy on julia avenue, and I told
many a black soul there the truths that I knew. When one truly isn't racist
"offensive" words sound different. The best thing one can do with wrongs
past, whether it happened to you, dad, or grandad, is to let it be a memory,
pass on the lesson objectively. Hate has no place here. I laugh at its
clumsy attempts at breaking in, but do I respond in kind? No, I smile and
put it out of mind, effectively rendering the pitiful thing blind. Racism is
as prevalent as your generation likes to make it. I'll give you a for
instance and then I'll quit it. I saw a friday or two gone a white man sing
chefs chocolate salty balls, unapologetically he walked onto the stage, but
neither was there one speck of derision nor hate, and the crowd to which he
sang was largely old black women, if you think they cared they didn't, the
only ones offended were white kids younger than me, they laughed along,
asked him where that song was from when he was done. one might even say it
made their night, it was a birthday group. we took shots with them too, and
laughed the night away without the fear of saying something wrong in the
right way.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I've spent most of my life on the "other side" of Macon Road, myself,
Travis, so I do know where you're coming from.

What high school did you attend?

Carver High School, here.
Trav
2018-02-03 08:35:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Trav
Post by Will Dockery
You seem like a nice guy, Travis, and as you know I really enjoy your
songs and poems, but the "fake Jew" taunting and the "get over it" stance
to those who write of such thins as the Holocaust (do you tell black folks
to get over their anger over the history of slavery, also) is a bit of a
red flag to me, who grew up with good old boys, nice as they can be, but
viciously racist, and quick to shun those not their kind, such as Yankees
and... Jews.
That just doesn't fit your style, knowing you in real life, which is why
it is surprising to see you take the right wing tone here on the internet.
That's my perspective, how it looks from here.
Will, the thing most people fail to understand about racism is that it
derives the vast majority of its power from those offended by it. When you
argue with racism you validate it. Why should anyone care what someone who
judges people on race thinks? We should laugh at them, not tighten our
assholes, and get all PC, that's what they want. The world polarizes and
those of us left in the middle take the heat from both sides while wondering
among ourselves at the willfully blind people we used to know as reasonable.
So in short will yes, I both believe wholeheartedly in white privilege, seen
it often because i've lived in the ghetto, on the wrong side of macon
road,where I was known as the crazy white boy on julia avenue, and I told
many a black soul there the truths that I knew. When one truly isn't racist
"offensive" words sound different. The best thing one can do with wrongs
past, whether it happened to you, dad, or grandad, is to let it be a memory,
pass on the lesson objectively. Hate has no place here. I laugh at its
clumsy attempts at breaking in, but do I respond in kind? No, I smile and
put it out of mind, effectively rendering the pitiful thing blind. Racism is
as prevalent as your generation likes to make it. I'll give you a for
instance and then I'll quit it. I saw a friday or two gone a white man sing
chefs chocolate salty balls, unapologetically he walked onto the stage, but
neither was there one speck of derision nor hate, and the crowd to which he
sang was largely old black women, if you think they cared they didn't, the
only ones offended were white kids younger than me, they laughed along,
asked him where that song was from when he was done. one might even say it
made their night, it was a birthday group. we took shots with them too, and
laughed the night away without the fear of saying something wrong in the
right way.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I've spent most of my life on the "other side" of Macon Road, myself,
Travis, so I do know where you're coming from.
What high school did you attend?
Carver High School, here.
I didn't say the "other" side, I said the wrong side. Have you ever been down the one way alley that is Julia Ave? I mean where macon turns into wynnton and intersects with buena vista. I didn't go to high school here Will, I moved here after graduating from Elmore County High School in Eclectic AL. I lived there as a fledgling to adulthood.
Will Dockery
2018-02-03 09:20:41 UTC
Permalink
Julia Avenue sounds familiar, but no, I never lived there.
Brooke
2018-02-01 22:36:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
You seem like a nice guy, Travis, and as you know I really enjoy your songs and poems, but the "fake Jew" taunting and the "get over it" stance to those who write of such thins as the Holocaust (do you tell black folks to get over their anger over the history of slavery, also) is a bit of a red flag to me, who grew up with good old boys, nice as they can be, but viciously racist, and quick to shun those not their kind, such as Yankees and... Jews.
That just doesn't fit your style, knowing you in real life, which is why it is surprising to see you take the right wing tone here on the internet.
That's my perspective, how it looks from here.
Oh give it up with the race and religion baiting, Will. Personally, I don't give a damn who one worships, who one fucks, votes for, or the color of anyone's skin unless it affects me and my family/friends. I believe most everyone here feels the same way. It's people like yourself and Stephen who keep throwing out the cliché buzzwords like Nazi, Fascist, Racist, etc. You do it to keep the drama going, which you live for.
Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
2018-02-01 22:58:43 UTC
Permalink
On Thursday, February 1, 2018 at 2:36:44 PM UTC-8, Brooke wrote

Shalom & Erev tov, Will...I find this incomprehensible. I never use 'buzzwords', but there are certain words I have chosen which I do not do lightly.

I am not interested in 'drama'. However, the bigotries here emanate from the premise of 'Never mind!', where my ontology is driven by 'Never again!'.

I have, like you, experienced 'race' and 'religion' baiting here, even though I do not use, in private or in my writing, the Greek word 'religio'.

Yaha'dut/'Judaism', for me, is a fluid paradigm: I believe 'that' has been my operating ethos, but I have no I believe 'in'. I do not 'worship' a 'who'. There is no Yehu'dit/'Jewish' 'race', nor DNA tests to identify oneself as a Yehu'di. There is no Yehu'dit 'blood'.

The only 'drama' I aware of is the relentless stupidity, Brooke, you keep enhancing with these childish accusations. I do not 'live' for the phantasies of natz'ri parasites.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
STEPHAN PICKERING / חפץ ח"ם בן אברהם
Torah אלילה Yehu'di Apikores / Philologia Kabbalistica Speculativa Researcher
לחיות זמן רב ולשגשג...לעולם לא עוד
THE KABBALAH FRACTALS PROJECT
Brooke
2018-02-01 23:38:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
Shalom & Erev tov, Will...I find this incomprehensible. I never use 'buzzwords', but there are certain words I have chosen which I do not do lightly.
I am not interested in 'drama'. However, the bigotries here emanate from the premise of 'Never mind!', where my ontology is driven by 'Never again!'.
I have, like you, experienced 'race' and 'religion' baiting here, even though I do not use, in private or in my writing, the Greek word 'religio'.
Yaha'dut/'Judaism', for me, is a fluid paradigm: I believe 'that' has been my operating ethos, but I have no I believe 'in'. I do not 'worship' a 'who'. There is no Yehu'dit/'Jewish' 'race', nor DNA tests to identify oneself as a Yehu'di. There is no Yehu'dit 'blood'.
The only 'drama' I aware of is the relentless stupidity, Brooke, you keep enhancing with these childish accusations. I do not 'live' for the phantasies of natz'ri parasites.
There you go again, Stephen. I've quickly bored of you and your mundane parroting. Keep blabbering on, as you always do. Your value to me, entertainment or otherwise, has expired. I won't even bother to read you, so save it.
Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
2018-02-01 23:45:46 UTC
Permalink
On Thursday, February 1, 2018 at 3:38:56 PM UTC-8, Brooke wrote:

Shalom & Erev tov, Will...She cannot formulate a coherent thought without unavoidably sounding like one of the Simpsons sniffing glue.. I need to remind her that, without electricity, Iron Butterfly would have been an aluminium caterpillar. She is a troll, a liar, unable to answer my own thorough refutation of her crackerism.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
STEPHAN PICKERING / חפץ ח"ם בן אברהם
Torah אלילה Yehu'di Apikores / Philologia Kabbalistica Speculativa Researcher
לחיות זמן רב ולשגשג...לעולם לא עוד
THE KABBALAH FRACTALS PROJEC
u***@gmail.com
2018-02-02 08:51:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chafetz Chayim benAvraham
Shalom & Erev tov, Will...She cannot formulate a
<<<<SMACK>>>>

Shaddap, Mr. Robotski. Same old shit, over and over. Have you an original thought in that pea brain of yours?
Will Dockery
2018-02-02 11:10:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by u***@gmail.com
an original thought
Not your strong suit, obviously, you ignorant troll.

:)
Will Dockery
2018-02-01 16:49:38 UTC
Permalink
Typo alert for spelling lamers:

I meant to type "thing" not "thin" in the last post.

😀
h***@gmail.com
2018-02-01 17:41:04 UTC
Permalink
One does not forget physical or emotional trauma, but time passes,
and wounds heal, sometimes leaving scars. One chooses how to
remember memories, whether to allow oneself to be haunted by
pain and regret, or empowered by forbearance and forgiveness.

Today is a good day to die when you have no regrets for what has
passed; accept responsibility for every action taken that resulted in
you being who you are right now, on a collision course with mortality,
having no fear, and only great expectations for whatever comes next.
drive-by
2018-02-01 17:43:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@gmail.com
One does not forget physical or emotional trauma, but time passes,
and wounds heal, sometimes leaving scars. One chooses how to
remember memories, whether to allow oneself to be haunted by
pain and regret, or empowered by forbearance and forgiveness.
Today is a good day to die when you have no regrets for what has
passed; accept responsibility for every action taken that resulted in
you being who you are right now, on a collision course with mortality,
having no fear, and only great expectations for whatever comes next.
Very nice Corey....nice write indeed.

J
h***@gmail.com
2018-02-01 18:21:45 UTC
Permalink
Life goes by like a bullet. We are given a certain trajectory at birth,
and reach our targets in a flash, long before rifle reports are heard.
We are where we are; we're going where we're going, and lives end
before people realize or appreciate the impact they've had on others.
Trav
2018-02-01 18:44:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@gmail.com
Life goes by like a bullet. We are given a certain trajectory at birth,
and reach our targets in a flash, long before rifle reports are heard.
We are where we are; we're going where we're going, and lives end
before people realize or appreciate the impact they've had on others.
Hi Corey!
Always a pleasure to see
enjoying your prose
so flippantly deep
I wonder what the others miss
If they don't give you a read
m***@gmail.com
2018-02-01 19:14:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@gmail.com
Life goes by like a bullet. We are given a certain trajectory at birth,
and reach our targets in a flash, long before rifle reports are heard.
We are where we are; we're going where we're going, and lives end
before people realize or appreciate the impact they've had on others.
Love this one.
m***@gmail.com
2018-02-01 19:13:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by drive-by
Post by h***@gmail.com
One does not forget physical or emotional trauma, but time passes,
and wounds heal, sometimes leaving scars. One chooses how to
remember memories, whether to allow oneself to be haunted by
pain and regret, or empowered by forbearance and forgiveness.
Today is a good day to die when you have no regrets for what has
passed; accept responsibility for every action taken that resulted in
you being who you are right now, on a collision course with mortality,
having no fear, and only great expectations for whatever comes next.
Very nice Corey....nice write indeed.
Agreed. It's basically a (good) modern poem "as is," but I'd like to see this one reworked in a more traditional form: blank verse at the very least.
Will Dockery
2018-02-03 02:35:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by m***@gmail.com
Agreed. It's basically a
<snip>

Another ghost sighting.

:)
Will Dockery
2018-02-01 19:03:37 UTC
Permalink
True, Corey gets in some good ones from time to time, but read them fast because they'll get deleted quick.

I'll post my list of the three best Corey poems, my picks, later, Travis.

😀
Will Dockery
2018-02-03 02:45:28 UTC
Permalink
You mean the Woody Harrelson look alike, Rachel?

😀
u***@gmail.com
2018-02-03 08:06:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
You mean the Woody Harrelson look alike, Rachel?
Shaddap, you Marty Allen lookalike.

Will Dockery
2018-02-03 10:57:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by u***@gmail.com
you Marty Allen lookalike
http://youtu.be/T8RrxdGzY-I
Marty Allen, I haven't thought of him in a long time.

I noticed my resemblance to George Savalas, also, a while back:

https://www.google.com/search?q=%22george+savalas%22&safe=off&rlz=1CASMAI_enUS742US742&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjX9uXNyonZAhXDo1kKHUz4DXsQ_AUICygC&biw=1242&bih=572

:)

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