Discussion:
Jack Kerouac, Football Star
(too old to reply)
Will Dockery
2005-04-06 04:02:55 UTC
Permalink
"Physical strength put Kerouac at a great advantage. From
the age of sixteen, he was blessed with a stocky, muscular
body. He played football at Lowell High School, becoming a
town hero and celebrity as he scored touchdown after touchdown.
His skill attracted the attention of many prestigious schools around
the east coast, and in 1940 Kerouac left Lowell for Columbia,
attracted
by its distinguished English department and the big-city life. There,
he
injured his right tibia and thus retired his football dreams."
http://archives.waiting-forthe-sun.net/Pages/ArtisticInfluences/Beats/BeatBios/kerouac_bio.html
So, WI Kerouac doesn't injure his right tibia, and manages to get over
his disagreements with the coach? Let's say that he manages to get
enough of a name for himself at Columbia that he gets drafted by the
NFL. With so many players off fighting in WW2, he has a chance to
prove himself a Big Star, albeit an unmanageable bad boy type.
American pro football history in the 1940s is extremely confusing IMO,
with teams and leagues constantly folding and merging. Any ideas on
this one, please?
I'm trying to come up with a WI in which Kerouac, upon retiring from
football, writes "On The Road" as a football memoir.....
And maybe stayed with Maggie?

I'm tossing this to the poetry newsgroups, many members of which seem to
know more about sports than poetry.

"Y'know man, when I was a young man in High School, can you believe it or
not... I wanted t'play football for the coach." -Lou Reed

--
Shadowville/Netherlands project:
http://www.kannibaal.nl/shadowville.htm

"Autograph 0f Zorro" Mp3:
http://www.kannibaal.nl/zorro.mp3

The Video:
http://www.kannibaal.nl
Stuart Leichter
2005-04-06 04:19:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
"Physical strength put Kerouac at a great advantage. From
the age of sixteen, he was blessed with a stocky, muscular
body. He played football at Lowell High School, becoming a
town hero and celebrity as he scored touchdown after touchdown.
His skill attracted the attention of many prestigious schools around
the east coast, and in 1940 Kerouac left Lowell for Columbia,
attracted
by its distinguished English department and the big-city life. There,
he
injured his right tibia and thus retired his football dreams."
http://archives.waiting-forthe-sun.net/Pages/ArtisticInfluences/Beats/BeatBios
/kerouac_bio.html
So, WI Kerouac doesn't injure his right tibia, and manages to get over
his disagreements with the coach? Let's say that he manages to get
enough of a name for himself at Columbia that he gets drafted by the
NFL. With so many players off fighting in WW2, he has a chance to
prove himself a Big Star, albeit an unmanageable bad boy type.
American pro football history in the 1940s is extremely confusing IMO,
with teams and leagues constantly folding and merging. Any ideas on
this one, please?
I'm trying to come up with a WI in which Kerouac, upon retiring from
football, writes "On The Road" as a football memoir.....
And maybe stayed with Maggie?
I'm tossing this to the poetry newsgroups, many members of which seem to
know more about sports than poetry.
Someone might check out Ann Charters' early bio of Kerouac. She also
recorded all of Scott Joplin's works before anyone else had (and long after
he'd been forgotten). She also teaches literature at U of Conn of basketball
fame a short time ago.
Will Dockery
2005-04-06 04:32:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stuart Leichter
Post by Will Dockery
"Physical strength put Kerouac at a great advantage. From
the age of sixteen, he was blessed with a stocky, muscular
body. He played football at Lowell High School, becoming a
town hero and celebrity as he scored touchdown after touchdown.
His skill attracted the attention of many prestigious schools around
the east coast, and in 1940 Kerouac left Lowell for Columbia,
attracted
by its distinguished English department and the big-city life. There,
he
injured his right tibia and thus retired his football dreams."
http://archives.waiting-forthe-sun.net/Pages/ArtisticInfluences/Beats/BeatBios
Post by Stuart Leichter
Post by Will Dockery
/kerouac_bio.html
So, WI Kerouac doesn't injure his right tibia, and manages to get over
his disagreements with the coach? Let's say that he manages to get
enough of a name for himself at Columbia that he gets drafted by the
NFL. With so many players off fighting in WW2, he has a chance to
prove himself a Big Star, albeit an unmanageable bad boy type.
American pro football history in the 1940s is extremely confusing IMO,
with teams and leagues constantly folding and merging. Any ideas on
this one, please?
I'm trying to come up with a WI in which Kerouac, upon retiring from
football, writes "On The Road" as a football memoir.....
And maybe stayed with Maggie?
I'm tossing this to the poetry newsgroups, many members of which seem to
know more about sports than poetry.
Someone might check out Ann Charters' early bio of Kerouac. She also
recorded all of Scott Joplin's works before anyone else had (and long after
he'd been forgotten). She also teaches literature at U of Conn of basketball
fame a short time ago.
Charters' bio was a major talisman of mine back in 1974, and after the
dozen of so Kerouac bios that came after, hers is still the favorite.
She didn't dig the dirt that some of the others did on our boy Jack,
but she captured the *man*.

Good to hear that she's still out there, living and breathing,
somewhere, as is sweet Carolyn.

--
Shadowville/Netherlands project:
http://www.kannibaal.nl/shadowville.htm

"Autograph 0f Zorro" Mp3:
http://www.kannibaal.nl/zorro.mp3

The Video:
http://www.kannibaal.nl
Zod The Mighty
2019-11-08 02:44:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stuart Leichter
Post by Will Dockery
"Physical strength put Kerouac at a great advantage. From
the age of sixteen, he was blessed with a stocky, muscular
body. He played football at Lowell High School, becoming a
town hero and celebrity as he scored touchdown after touchdown.
His skill attracted the attention of many prestigious schools around
the east coast, and in 1940 Kerouac left Lowell for Columbia,
attracted
by its distinguished English department and the big-city life. There,
he
injured his right tibia and thus retired his football dreams."
http://archives.waiting-forthe-sun.net/Pages/ArtisticInfluences/Beats/BeatBios
/kerouac_bio.html
So, WI Kerouac doesn't injure his right tibia, and manages to get over
his disagreements with the coach? Let's say that he manages to get
enough of a name for himself at Columbia that he gets drafted by the
NFL. With so many players off fighting in WW2, he has a chance to
prove himself a Big Star, albeit an unmanageable bad boy type.
American pro football history in the 1940s is extremely confusing IMO,
with teams and leagues constantly folding and merging. Any ideas on
this one, please?
I'm trying to come up with a WI in which Kerouac, upon retiring from
football, writes "On The Road" as a football memoir.....
And maybe stayed with Maggie?
I'm tossing this to the poetry newsgroups, many members of which seem to
know more about sports than poetry.
Someone might check out Ann Charters' early bio of Kerouac. She also
recorded all of Scott Joplin's works before anyone else had (and long after
he'd been forgotten). She also teaches literature at U of Conn of basketball
fame a short time ago.
Aspect of Kerouac rarely explored....
Will Dockery
2019-11-08 07:32:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stuart Leichter
Post by Will Dockery
"Physical strength put Kerouac at a great advantage. From
the age of sixteen, he was blessed with a stocky, muscular
body. He played football at Lowell High School, becoming a
town hero and celebrity as he scored touchdown after touchdown.
His skill attracted the attention of many prestigious schools around
the east coast, and in 1940 Kerouac left Lowell for Columbia,
attracted
by its distinguished English department and the big-city life. There,
he
injured his right tibia and thus retired his football dreams."
http://archives.waiting-forthe-sun.net/Pages/ArtisticInfluences/Beats/BeatBios
/kerouac_bio.html
So, WI Kerouac doesn't injure his right tibia, and manages to get over
his disagreements with the coach? Let's say that he manages to get
enough of a name for himself at Columbia that he gets drafted by the
NFL. With so many players off fighting in WW2, he has a chance to
prove himself a Big Star, albeit an unmanageable bad boy type.
American pro football history in the 1940s is extremely confusing IMO,
with teams and leagues constantly folding and merging. Any ideas on
this one, please?
I'm trying to come up with a WI in which Kerouac, upon retiring from
football, writes "On The Road" as a football memoir.....
And maybe stayed with Maggie?
I'm tossing this to the poetry newsgroups, many members of which seem to
know more about sports than poetry.
Someone might check out Ann Charters' early bio of Kerouac. She also
recorded all of Scott Joplin's works before anyone else had (and long after
he'd been forgotten). She also teaches literature at U of Conn of basketball
fame a short time ago.
Aspect of Kerouac rarely explored....
Kerouac's "Vanity of Dulouz" covered that era.
f***@yahoo.com
2005-04-06 11:04:10 UTC
Permalink
"Physical strength put Kerouac at a great advantage. From
the age of sixteen, he was blessed with a stocky, muscular
body. He played football at Lowell High School, becoming a
town hero and celebrity as he scored touchdown after touchdown.
His skill attracted the attention of many prestigious schools around
the east coast, and in 1940 Kerouac left Lowell for Columbia,
attracted
by its distinguished English department and the big-city life. There,
he
injured his right tibia and thus retired his football dreams."
http://archives.waiting-forthe-sun.net/Pages/ArtisticInfluences/Beats/BeatBios/kerouac_bio.html
So, WI Kerouac doesn't injure his right tibia, and manages to get over
his disagreements with the coach? Let's say that he manages to get
enough of a name for himself at Columbia that he gets drafted by the
NFL. With so many players off fighting in WW2, he has a chance to
prove himself a Big Star, albeit an unmanageable bad boy type.
American pro football history in the 1940s is extremely confusing IMO,
with teams and leagues constantly folding and merging. Any ideas on
this one, please?
I'm trying to come up with a WI in which Kerouac, upon retiring from
football, writes "On The Road" as a football memoir.....
If Whizzer White can become a Supreme Court justice, Keroac can play
football.

Did the NFL even exist in 1945? Pro football was small time until
about 1960 and even then it wasn't much. It was mostly guys who liked
to play and were insurance agents and stuff like that in the off season
to make a living, and pro football was dwarfed by the college game.
The Columbia football team might have been hot stuff then.
Jack Linthicum
2005-04-06 11:32:56 UTC
Permalink
"Physical strength put Kerouac at a great advantage. From
the age of sixteen, he was blessed with a stocky, muscular
body. He played football at Lowell High School, becoming a
town hero and celebrity as he scored touchdown after touchdown.
His skill attracted the attention of many prestigious schools
around
the east coast, and in 1940 Kerouac left Lowell for Columbia,
attracted
by its distinguished English department and the big-city life.
There,
he
injured his right tibia and thus retired his football dreams."
http://archives.waiting-forthe-sun.net/Pages/ArtisticInfluences/Beats/BeatBios/kerouac_bio.html
So, WI Kerouac doesn't injure his right tibia, and manages to get
over
his disagreements with the coach? Let's say that he manages to get
enough of a name for himself at Columbia that he gets drafted by
the
NFL. With so many players off fighting in WW2, he has a chance to
prove himself a Big Star, albeit an unmanageable bad boy type.
American pro football history in the 1940s is extremely confusing
IMO,
with teams and leagues constantly folding and merging. Any ideas on
this one, please?
I'm trying to come up with a WI in which Kerouac, upon retiring
from
football, writes "On The Road" as a football memoir.....
If Whizzer White can become a Supreme Court justice, Keroac can play
football.
Did the NFL even exist in 1945? Pro football was small time until
about 1960 and even then it wasn't much. It was mostly guys who liked
to play and were insurance agents and stuff like that in the off season
to make a living, and pro football was dwarfed by the college game.
The Columbia football team might have been hot stuff then.
There was an article in Sports Illustrated way back when that described
Kerouac's reaction to the football coach at Columbia. The google says
Lou Little was coach who would not play Kerouac.

The NFL was not much in 1945, having teams like the PHil-Pitts formed
from the Philadelphia Eagles and Pittsburgh Steelers to save travel
money. By 1946 when the All-American Conference (Cleveland Browns, San
Francisco 49ers, etc) formed a small salary war had started. There were
teams in Los Angeles and Miami where the glamour was greater. The LA
Ram quarterback Bob Waterfield married Jane Russel and things started
looking up.

But unless Kerouac was as good as he thought he was and escaped injury
he would have been a flash in the pan.
Will Dockery
2005-04-06 16:02:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by f***@yahoo.com
"Physical strength put Kerouac at a great advantage. From
the age of sixteen, he was blessed with a stocky, muscular
body. He played football at Lowell High School, becoming a
town hero and celebrity as he scored touchdown after touchdown.
His skill attracted the attention of many prestigious schools
around
the east coast, and in 1940 Kerouac left Lowell for Columbia,
attracted
by its distinguished English department and the big-city life.
There,
he
injured his right tibia and thus retired his football dreams."
http://archives.waiting-forthe-sun.net/Pages/ArtisticInfluences/Beats/BeatBios/kerouac_bio.html
Post by f***@yahoo.com
So, WI Kerouac doesn't injure his right tibia, and manages to get
over
his disagreements with the coach? Let's say that he manages to
get
enough of a name for himself at Columbia that he gets drafted by
the
NFL. With so many players off fighting in WW2, he has a chance to
prove himself a Big Star, albeit an unmanageable bad boy type.
American pro football history in the 1940s is extremely confusing
IMO,
with teams and leagues constantly folding and merging. Any ideas
on
this one, please?
I'm trying to come up with a WI in which Kerouac, upon retiring
from
football, writes "On The Road" as a football memoir.....
If Whizzer White can become a Supreme Court justice, Keroac can play
football.
Did the NFL even exist in 1945? Pro football was small time until
about 1960 and even then it wasn't much. It was mostly guys who
liked
to play and were insurance agents and stuff like that in the off
season
to make a living, and pro football was dwarfed by the college game.
The Columbia football team might have been hot stuff then.
There was an article in Sports Illustrated way back when that described
Kerouac's reaction to the football coach at Columbia. The google says
Lou Little was coach who would not play Kerouac.
The NFL was not much in 1945, having teams like the PHil-Pitts formed
from the Philadelphia Eagles and Pittsburgh Steelers to save travel
money. By 1946 when the All-American Conference (Cleveland Browns, San
Francisco 49ers, etc) formed a small salary war had started. There were
teams in Los Angeles and Miami where the glamour was greater. The LA
Ram quarterback Bob Waterfield married Jane Russel and things started
looking up.
But unless Kerouac was as good as he thought he was and escaped injury
he would have been a flash in the pan.
"...I went home. And write this book." -Kerouac
--
"from Subterraneans" [Jack Kerouac]
http://www.kilbot.net/writing/subterraneans.php

"Charlie Parker" [Jack Kerouac]
http://www.kilbot.net/writing/charlieparker.php

"Some American Haikus" [Jack Kerouac]
http://www-hsc.usc.edu/~gallaher/k_speaks/kerouacspeaks.html
b***@forpresident.com
2005-04-06 19:12:05 UTC
Permalink
Also, the NFL was the first major sports league in the US to integrate,
with
Woody Strode playing for the Rams (IIRC one season in Cleveland and one

in LA before he retired to go into acting)
Jack Linthicum
2005-04-06 19:30:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@forpresident.com
Also, the NFL was the first major sports league in the US to
integrate,
Post by b***@forpresident.com
with
Woody Strode playing for the Rams (IIRC one season in Cleveland and one
in LA before he retired to go into acting)
Kenny Washington (March 21) several weeks ahead of Woody Strode (May 7)
as first African-American in the NFL since 1933. Washington once kicked
a 73-yard field goal for the (Minor league) Hollywood Bears.
b***@forpresident.com
2005-04-06 19:42:28 UTC
Permalink
So there were African-American NFL players in the 1930s? I didn't know
that. This would have made pro football the only major American sport
at the time to be desegregated. Granted the NFL was pretty small time
pre World War II (and didn't really become the institution we all
recognize
until the mid 50s) but that is rather unusual. Is it possible for the
NFL to
keep signing African American players in the late 30s and early 40s?

One consequence of this: Jackie Robinson (whose talents in football
were considered as great as his baseball talents) as a pro football
star rather than a baseball star. Although, as in OTL, that whole
generation of athletes, black and white, will lose many of their best
playing years due to WW2.

ObWI: integration of pro baseball during the war. ISTR reading that
there was an MLB team that wanted to have black players during
the war, but didn't.
Peter Ceresole
2005-04-06 19:52:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@forpresident.com
ObWI: integration of pro baseball during the war. ISTR reading that
there was an MLB team that wanted to have black players during
the war, but didn't.
When you consider that the US Army remained segregated at that time- so
that blacks were not even allowed equality of sacrifice- this doesn't
seem terribly surprising.
--
Peter
d***@pacbell.net
2005-04-07 11:20:36 UTC
Permalink
Ok, so he's a football star in the pros. The road games satisfy his
restlessness and he never meets Neal Cassidy. On the Road is never
written
Jack Linthicum
2005-04-07 11:46:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by d***@pacbell.net
Ok, so he's a football star in the pros. The road games satisfy his
restlessness and he never meets Neal Cassidy. On the Road is never
written
Or, after a game at Los Angeles or New York someone tells him he should
be an actor. The pay is moderately better than getting hit by large
people so he boogies off to act. He has sort of Anthony Perkins looks,
the lost waif who needs a mother or a lover to understand him, and he
hits the big time. Several roles in Oscar-winning movies, the hero's
best friend and the manipulative agent, he takes on a book about his
life and eventually starts to fade as the drugs take hold. In the end
he and Mickey Spillane are living next to each other in Murrell's
Inlet, SC and he dies in a obvious overdose. (Or worse he ends up in
the little house in Orlando he did end up in)
Will Dockery
2005-04-07 17:00:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by d***@pacbell.net
Ok, so he's a football star in the pros. The road games satisfy his
restlessness and he never meets Neal Cassidy. On the Road is never
written
Or, after a game at Los Angeles or New York someone tells him he should
be an actor. The pay is moderately better than getting hit by large
people so he boogies off to act. He has sort of Anthony Perkins looks,
the lost waif who needs a mother or a lover to understand him, and he
hits the big time. Several roles in Oscar-winning movies, the hero's
best friend and the manipulative agent, he takes on a book about his
life and eventually starts to fade as the drugs take hold. In the end
he and Mickey Spillane are living next to each other in Murrell's
Inlet, SC and he dies in a obvious overdose. (Or worse he ends up in
the little house in Orlando he did end up in)
Actually Kerouac died in Saint Petersberg, Florida...

Kerouac came close to Hollywood a couple of times. Once, early on, he
wrote screenplay treatments.

--
Shadowville/Netherlands project:
http://www.kannibaal.nl/shadowville.htm

"Autograph 0f Zorro" Mp3:
http://www.kannibaal.nl/zorro.mp3
j r sherman
2005-04-07 17:30:17 UTC
Permalink
In article <***@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>, Will Dockery
says...
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by d***@pacbell.net
Ok, so he's a football star in the pros. The road games satisfy
his
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by d***@pacbell.net
restlessness and he never meets Neal Cassidy. On the Road is never
written
Or, after a game at Los Angeles or New York someone tells him he
should
Post by Jack Linthicum
be an actor. The pay is moderately better than getting hit by large
people so he boogies off to act. He has sort of Anthony Perkins
looks,
Post by Jack Linthicum
the lost waif who needs a mother or a lover to understand him, and he
hits the big time. Several roles in Oscar-winning movies, the hero's
best friend and the manipulative agent, he takes on a book about his
life and eventually starts to fade as the drugs take hold. In the end
he and Mickey Spillane are living next to each other in Murrell's
Inlet, SC and he dies in a obvious overdose. (Or worse he ends up in
the little house in Orlando he did end up in)
Actually Kerouac died in Saint Petersberg, Florida...
Kerouac came close to Hollywood a couple of times. Once, early on, he
wrote screenplay treatments.
really? where can one find out about this?
--
------------------------------------------------------------------
"I saw a werewolf drinkin' a pina colada at Trader Vic's
And his hair was perfect."
Warren Zevon
------------------------------------------------------------------
Jack Linthicum
2005-04-07 17:50:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by d***@pacbell.net
Ok, so he's a football star in the pros. The road games satisfy
his
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by d***@pacbell.net
restlessness and he never meets Neal Cassidy. On the Road is never
written
Or, after a game at Los Angeles or New York someone tells him he
should
Post by Jack Linthicum
be an actor. The pay is moderately better than getting hit by large
people so he boogies off to act. He has sort of Anthony Perkins
looks,
Post by Jack Linthicum
the lost waif who needs a mother or a lover to understand him, and he
hits the big time. Several roles in Oscar-winning movies, the hero's
best friend and the manipulative agent, he takes on a book about his
life and eventually starts to fade as the drugs take hold. In the end
he and Mickey Spillane are living next to each other in Murrell's
Inlet, SC and he dies in a obvious overdose. (Or worse he ends up in
the little house in Orlando he did end up in)
Actually Kerouac died in Saint Petersberg, Florida...
Kerouac came close to Hollywood a couple of times. Once, early on, he
wrote screenplay treatments.
--
http://www.kannibaal.nl/shadowville.htm
http://www.kannibaal.nl/zorro.mp3
My wife is a great Kerouac fan. There is a book out by a local reporter
named Kealing about Kerouac's house in Orlando. We went to the "scroll'
exhibit, with pictures of Kerouac and his crowd, excerpts from his
letters, etc.
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/travel/getaways/orlando/sfl-beatorlandofeb22,0,1520445.story?coll=sfla-travel-orlando
Will Dockery
2005-04-07 18:29:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by d***@pacbell.net
Ok, so he's a football star in the pros. The road games
satisfy
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by Jack Linthicum
his
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by d***@pacbell.net
restlessness and he never meets Neal Cassidy. On the Road is
never
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by d***@pacbell.net
written
Or, after a game at Los Angeles or New York someone tells him he
should
Post by Jack Linthicum
be an actor. The pay is moderately better than getting hit by large
people so he boogies off to act. He has sort of Anthony Perkins
looks,
Post by Jack Linthicum
the lost waif who needs a mother or a lover to understand him,
and
Post by Jack Linthicum
he
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by Jack Linthicum
hits the big time. Several roles in Oscar-winning movies, the
hero's
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by Jack Linthicum
best friend and the manipulative agent, he takes on a book about
his
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by Jack Linthicum
life and eventually starts to fade as the drugs take hold. In the
end
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by Jack Linthicum
he and Mickey Spillane are living next to each other in Murrell's
Inlet, SC and he dies in a obvious overdose. (Or worse he ends up
in
Post by Jack Linthicum
Post by Jack Linthicum
the little house in Orlando he did end up in)
Actually Kerouac died in Saint Petersberg, Florida...
Kerouac came close to Hollywood a couple of times. Once, early on, he
wrote screenplay treatments.
My wife is a great Kerouac fan. There is a book out by a local
reporter
Post by Jack Linthicum
named Kealing about Kerouac's house in Orlando. We went to the
"scroll'
Post by Jack Linthicum
exhibit, with pictures of Kerouac and his crowd, excerpts from his
letters, etc.
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/travel/getaways/orlando/sfl-beatorlandofeb22,0,1520445.story?coll=sfla-travel-orlando

True, in those last years Kerouac, usually on a whim of his mother, was
constantly back and forth, moving to Florida, then back to Lowell, back
to Florida, et cetera.

The last of these moves left him in the Saint Petersberg area.

Ellis Amburn:

"...the bar was a hostile dive in Saint Petersberg, called the Cactus,
and Kerouac made the mistake of going there with a disabled Air Force
veteran who was even more erotically demonstative and affectionate with
strangers than Kerouac was. They started talking with a jazz musicain
and the airman casually put his arm around him. Assuming that he was
being propositioned, the musician threw a punch at Jack's friend. "He's
no queer!", Jack screamed, but the musician, who was also a former
boxer, said, "So you want it, too?"

Several black men dragged Kerouac into the parking lot, and he was
'badly beaten up'. [...] After the beating, he never fully recovered,
dropping twenty pounds..." He died less than a month later, after
collapsing in the latrine at his house on 5515 10th Avenue North, in
Saint Petersberg, at 5:15 am, October 21 1969.

Walter Cronkite on CBS news that night:

"Jack Kerouac, the novelist who wrote On The Road, reached the end of
it today. The 47-year-old spokesman for the Beat Generation died of a
massive hemorrage in a Saint Petersberg hospital today. Kerouac's books
were regarded as a bridge between older bohemians and today's hippies."

--
Shadowville/Netherlands project:
http://www.kannibaal.nl/shadowville.htm

"Autograph 0f Zorro" Mp3:
http://www.kannibaal.nl/zorro.mp3
b***@forpresident.com
2005-04-07 17:24:35 UTC
Permalink
Terry Southern, in his essay about Mickey Spillane turning
to acting, predicted a sort of trend, and pondered the difficulties a
director would have trying to direct Kerouac or
Mailer.

He was half right in his predictions. Kerouac never acted, but
Mailer would turn to acting. (Remember "Maidstone"?)
Will Dockery
2005-04-07 17:47:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@forpresident.com
Terry Southern, in his essay about Mickey Spillane turning
to acting, predicted a sort of trend, and pondered the difficulties a
director would have trying to direct Kerouac or
Mailer.
He was half right in his predictions. Kerouac never acted, but
Mailer would turn to acting. (Remember "Maidstone"?)
From what I saw of Kerouac's television appearances, he "froze up" on
camera.

Film is different from television, certainly the television of 50 years
ago, and it would have been interesting to see how it would've turned
out, since Kerouac saw what he did as writing "book movies", anyhow.

He'd certainly have done a better job playing himself rather than
George Peppard's Leo in Subterraneans, and I can easily see Kerouac in
place of the Kerouac look-alike they put in Route 66, the uncredited
television reworking of On The Road.

Getting back to the pro football alternate reality Kerouac, since he
already knew Ginsberg and Burroughs through Columbia, after an injury
in the pros, he could easily have come back to the still evolving Beat
group, and still have met Neal Cassady. It may have helped him get the
second book published, being "famous" in football, or there may have
been another second book dealing with the characters he would have met
touring with the team: players and fans.

This could have changed history in a big way, though, because after the
pro football gig, he might have continued on with his first style of
writing as in The Town And The City, and never have created his
spontaeneous prose style.

--
Shadowville/Netherlands project:
http://www.kannibaal.nl/shadowville.htm

"Autograph 0f Zorro" Mp3:
http://www.kannibaal.nl/zorro.mp3
b***@forpresident.com
2005-04-07 19:48:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
Post by b***@forpresident.com
Terry Southern, in his essay about Mickey Spillane turning
to acting, predicted a sort of trend, and pondered the difficulties a
director would have trying to direct Kerouac or
Mailer.
He was half right in his predictions. Kerouac never acted, but
Mailer would turn to acting. (Remember "Maidstone"?)
From what I saw of Kerouac's television appearances, he "froze up" on
camera.
Film is different from television, certainly the television of 50 years
ago, and it would have been interesting to see how it would've turned
out, since Kerouac saw what he did as writing "book movies", anyhow.
He'd certainly have done a better job playing himself rather than
George Peppard's Leo in Subterraneans, and I can easily see Kerouac in
place of the Kerouac look-alike they put in Route 66, the uncredited
television reworking of On The Road.
Getting back to the pro football alternate reality Kerouac, since he
already knew Ginsberg and Burroughs through Columbia,
ISTR in the Charters book something about the student Ginsberg having
aspirations of being a sportswriter. That would be interesting in
itself ;
although the realities of midcentury America may intrude into his
lengthy, lusty descriptions of athletes' bodies.....

after an injury
Post by Will Dockery
in the pros, he could easily have come back to the still evolving Beat
group, and still have met Neal Cassady. It may have helped him get the
second book published, being "famous" in football, or there may have
been another second book dealing with the characters he would have met
touring with the team: players and fans.
That was the idea behind my original WI: On The Road as a football
memoir. I don't see it having the same influence as in OTL ; OTOH,
it will reach readers who would never have picked up OTL's OTR.

To combine these two threads into one, there is a long tradition of
American football players going into acting, dating back at least as
far as John Wayne. So, perhaps ex-footballer Kerouac becomes a
thespian.....

Stan B.

BTW, in general, if people crosspost in SHWI, let them crosspost from
alt.books.beatgeneration,
alt.poetry, alt.arts.poetry.comments and rec.arts.poems rather than
revisionist NGs.
Will Dockery
2005-04-07 20:23:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@forpresident.com
Post by Will Dockery
Post by b***@forpresident.com
Terry Southern, in his essay about Mickey Spillane turning
to acting, predicted a sort of trend, and pondered the difficulties
a
Post by Will Dockery
Post by b***@forpresident.com
director would have trying to direct Kerouac or
Mailer.
He was half right in his predictions. Kerouac never acted, but
Mailer would turn to acting. (Remember "Maidstone"?)
From what I saw of Kerouac's television appearances, he "froze up"
on
Post by Will Dockery
camera.
Film is different from television, certainly the television of 50
years
Post by Will Dockery
ago, and it would have been interesting to see how it would've turned
out, since Kerouac saw what he did as writing "book movies", anyhow.
He'd certainly have done a better job playing himself rather than
George Peppard's Leo in Subterraneans, and I can easily see Kerouac
in
Post by Will Dockery
place of the Kerouac look-alike they put in Route 66, the uncredited
television reworking of On The Road.
Getting back to the pro football alternate reality Kerouac, since he
already knew Ginsberg and Burroughs through Columbia,
ISTR in the Charters book something about the student Ginsberg having
aspirations of being a sportswriter. That would be interesting in
itself ;
although the realities of midcentury America may intrude into his
lengthy, lusty descriptions of athletes' bodies.....
Kerouac's entrance into pro football could have been Ginsy's break!
Post by b***@forpresident.com
after an injury
Post by Will Dockery
in the pros, he could easily have come back to the still evolving
Beat
Post by Will Dockery
group, and still have met Neal Cassady. It may have helped him get
the
Post by Will Dockery
second book published, being "famous" in football, or there may have
been another second book dealing with the characters he would have
met
Post by Will Dockery
touring with the team: players and fans.
That was the idea behind my original WI: On The Road as a football
memoir. I don't see it having the same influence as in OTL ; OTOH,
it will reach readers who would never have picked up OTL's OTR.
To combine these two threads into one, there is a long tradition of
American football players going into acting, dating back at least as
far as John Wayne. So, perhaps ex-footballer Kerouac becomes a
thespian.....
Joe Namath was great in Norwood!

--
Shadowville/Netherlands project:
http://www.kannibaal.nl/shadowville.htm

"Autograph 0f Zorro" Mp3:
http://www.kannibaal.nl/zorro.mp3
General Zod
2019-11-05 09:31:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
Post by b***@forpresident.com
Post by Will Dockery
Post by b***@forpresident.com
Terry Southern, in his essay about Mickey Spillane turning
to acting, predicted a sort of trend, and pondered the difficulties
a
Post by Will Dockery
Post by b***@forpresident.com
director would have trying to direct Kerouac or
Mailer.
He was half right in his predictions. Kerouac never acted, but
Mailer would turn to acting. (Remember "Maidstone"?)
From what I saw of Kerouac's television appearances, he "froze up"
on
Post by Will Dockery
camera.
Film is different from television, certainly the television of 50
years
Post by Will Dockery
ago, and it would have been interesting to see how it would've turned
out, since Kerouac saw what he did as writing "book movies", anyhow.
He'd certainly have done a better job playing himself rather than
George Peppard's Leo in Subterraneans, and I can easily see Kerouac
in
Post by Will Dockery
place of the Kerouac look-alike they put in Route 66, the uncredited
television reworking of On The Road.
Getting back to the pro football alternate reality Kerouac, since he
already knew Ginsberg and Burroughs through Columbia,
ISTR in the Charters book something about the student Ginsberg having
aspirations of being a sportswriter. That would be interesting in
itself ;
although the realities of midcentury America may intrude into his
lengthy, lusty descriptions of athletes' bodies.....
Kerouac's entrance into pro football could have been Ginsy's break!
Post by b***@forpresident.com
after an injury
Post by Will Dockery
in the pros, he could easily have come back to the still evolving
Beat
Post by Will Dockery
group, and still have met Neal Cassady. It may have helped him get
the
Post by Will Dockery
second book published, being "famous" in football, or there may have
been another second book dealing with the characters he would have
met
Post by Will Dockery
touring with the team: players and fans.
That was the idea behind my original WI: On The Road as a football
memoir. I don't see it having the same influence as in OTL ; OTOH,
it will reach readers who would never have picked up OTL's OTR.
To combine these two threads into one, there is a long tradition of
American football players going into acting, dating back at least as
far as John Wayne. So, perhaps ex-footballer Kerouac becomes a
thespian.....
Joe Namath was great in Norwood!
--
http://www.kannibaal.nl/shadowville.htm
http://www.kannibaal.nl/zorro.mp3
Interesting history piece....
d***@pacbell.net
2005-04-08 20:04:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
Post by b***@forpresident.com
Terry Southern, in his essay about Mickey Spillane turning
to acting, predicted a sort of trend, and pondered the difficulties a
director would have trying to direct Kerouac or
Mailer.
He was half right in his predictions. Kerouac never acted, but
Mailer would turn to acting. (Remember "Maidstone"?)
From what I saw of Kerouac's television appearances, he "froze up" on
camera.
Film is different from television, certainly the television of 50 years
ago, and it would have been interesting to see how it would've turned
out, since Kerouac saw what he did as writing "book movies", anyhow.
He'd certainly have done a better job playing himself rather than
George Peppard's Leo in Subterraneans, and I can easily see Kerouac in
place of the Kerouac look-alike they put in Route 66, the uncredited
television reworking of On The Road.
Getting back to the pro football alternate reality Kerouac, since he
already knew Ginsberg and Burroughs through Columbia, after an injury
in the pros, he could easily have come back to the still evolving Beat
group, and still have met Neal Cassady. It may have helped him get the
second book published, being "famous" in football, or there may have
been another second book dealing with the characters he would have met
touring with the team: players and fans.
This could have changed history in a big way, though, because after the
pro football gig, he might have continued on with his first style of
writing as in The Town And The City, and never have created his
spontaeneous prose style.
--
http://www.kannibaal.nl/shadowville.htm
http://www.kannibaal.nl/zorro.mp3
Wow, thanks Will. That gave me a minor epiphany...so Buzz Murdoch was
modeled on Kerouac? Martin Milner was an insipid Cassidy.
Anyway, If Jack was to find some fame and recognition in football or
anything else, his writing would suffer because al lot of his appeal
was his alienation.
Jack Linthicum
2005-04-08 20:10:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by d***@pacbell.net
Post by Will Dockery
Post by b***@forpresident.com
Terry Southern, in his essay about Mickey Spillane turning
to acting, predicted a sort of trend, and pondered the
difficulties
Post by d***@pacbell.net
a
Post by Will Dockery
Post by b***@forpresident.com
director would have trying to direct Kerouac or
Mailer.
He was half right in his predictions. Kerouac never acted, but
Mailer would turn to acting. (Remember "Maidstone"?)
From what I saw of Kerouac's television appearances, he "froze up"
on
Post by Will Dockery
camera.
Film is different from television, certainly the television of 50
years
Post by Will Dockery
ago, and it would have been interesting to see how it would've turned
out, since Kerouac saw what he did as writing "book movies",
anyhow.
Post by d***@pacbell.net
Post by Will Dockery
He'd certainly have done a better job playing himself rather than
George Peppard's Leo in Subterraneans, and I can easily see Kerouac
in
Post by Will Dockery
place of the Kerouac look-alike they put in Route 66, the
uncredited
Post by d***@pacbell.net
Post by Will Dockery
television reworking of On The Road.
Getting back to the pro football alternate reality Kerouac, since he
already knew Ginsberg and Burroughs through Columbia, after an injury
in the pros, he could easily have come back to the still evolving
Beat
Post by Will Dockery
group, and still have met Neal Cassady. It may have helped him get
the
Post by Will Dockery
second book published, being "famous" in football, or there may have
been another second book dealing with the characters he would have
met
Post by Will Dockery
touring with the team: players and fans.
This could have changed history in a big way, though, because after
the
Post by Will Dockery
pro football gig, he might have continued on with his first style of
writing as in The Town And The City, and never have created his
spontaeneous prose style.
--
http://www.kannibaal.nl/shadowville.htm
http://www.kannibaal.nl/zorro.mp3
Wow, thanks Will. That gave me a minor epiphany...so Buzz Murdoch was
modeled on Kerouac? Martin Milner was an insipid Cassidy.
Anyway, If Jack was to find some fame and recognition in football or
anything else, his writing would suffer because al lot of his appeal
was his alienation.
He would have written the "Ball Four" of football.
http://www.jimbouton.com/ballfour.html
Will Dockery
2005-04-08 20:25:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by d***@pacbell.net
Post by Will Dockery
Post by b***@forpresident.com
Terry Southern, in his essay about Mickey Spillane turning
to acting, predicted a sort of trend, and pondered the difficulties
a
Post by Will Dockery
Post by b***@forpresident.com
director would have trying to direct Kerouac or
Mailer.
He was half right in his predictions. Kerouac never acted, but
Mailer would turn to acting. (Remember "Maidstone"?)
From what I saw of Kerouac's television appearances, he "froze up"
on
Post by Will Dockery
camera.
Film is different from television, certainly the television of 50
years
Post by Will Dockery
ago, and it would have been interesting to see how it would've turned
out, since Kerouac saw what he did as writing "book movies", anyhow.
He'd certainly have done a better job playing himself rather than
George Peppard's Leo in Subterraneans, and I can easily see Kerouac
in
Post by Will Dockery
place of the Kerouac look-alike they put in Route 66, the uncredited
television reworking of On The Road.
Getting back to the pro football alternate reality Kerouac, since he
already knew Ginsberg and Burroughs through Columbia, after an injury
in the pros, he could easily have come back to the still evolving
Beat
Post by Will Dockery
group, and still have met Neal Cassady. It may have helped him get
the
Post by Will Dockery
second book published, being "famous" in football, or there may have
been another second book dealing with the characters he would have
met
Post by Will Dockery
touring with the team: players and fans.
This could have changed history in a big way, though, because after
the
Post by Will Dockery
pro football gig, he might have continued on with his first style of
writing as in The Town And The City, and never have created his
spontaeneous prose style.
Wow, thanks Will. That gave me a minor epiphany...so Buzz Murdoch was
modeled on Kerouac? Martin Milner was an insipid Cassidy.
Anyway, If Jack was to find some fame and recognition in football or
anything else, his writing would suffer because al lot of his appeal
was his alienation.
Ellis Amburn:

"Had [Kerouac] owned a piece of the merchandising that stemmed from On The
Road, he'd have been a multi-millionaire.

Though the television situation comedy Dobie Gillis was based on Max Shulman
short stories, the Beat character, Maynard G. Krebs, was created expressly
for the television show following the success of On The Road. Running from
1960 to 1964, Route 66, a sanitized retread of On The Road, was a hit series
for 116 episodes and worth millions of dollars. 'The idea was for everybody
to rediscover the United States through our characters' eyes,' recalled
Martin Milner, who played Tod Stiles. George Maharis, a dead ringer for
Kerouac, played Tod's sidekick, Buzz Murdock. Enraged, Kerouac charged
plagiarism, and he attempted unsuccessfully to sue on two different
occasions."

As an actor, Kerouac clearly could've been a contender.
--
"Black Eagle Lady" [Conley/Dockery]
http://www.lulu.com/items/26000/26894/preview/Irony_Waves_-_Track__1.mp3

"Evocation: Laura Redwood" [Will Dockery]
http://www.lulu.com/items/26000/26961/preview/Irony_Waves_-_Track__6.mp3
j r sherman
2005-04-07 17:30:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@forpresident.com
Terry Southern, in his essay about Mickey Spillane turning
to acting, predicted a sort of trend, and pondered the difficulties a
director would have trying to direct Kerouac or
Mailer.
He was half right in his predictions. Kerouac never acted, but
Mailer would turn to acting. (Remember "Maidstone"?)
and Ragtime.
--
------------------------------------------------------------------
"I saw a werewolf drinkin' a pina colada at Trader Vic's
And his hair was perfect."
Warren Zevon
------------------------------------------------------------------
Jack Linthicum
2005-04-14 10:57:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@forpresident.com
So there were African-American NFL players in the 1930s? I didn't know
that. This would have made pro football the only major American sport
at the time to be desegregated. Granted the NFL was pretty small time
pre World War II (and didn't really become the institution we all
recognize
until the mid 50s) but that is rather unusual. Is it possible for the
NFL to
keep signing African American players in the late 30s and early 40s?
One consequence of this: Jackie Robinson (whose talents in football
were considered as great as his baseball talents) as a pro football
star rather than a baseball star. Although, as in OTL, that whole
generation of athletes, black and white, will lose many of their best
playing years due to WW2.
ObWI: integration of pro baseball during the war. ISTR reading that
there was an MLB team that wanted to have black players during
the war, but didn't.
April 15 is Jackie Robinson Day in Major League Baseball, and...
http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-robinson14apr14,0,2895119.story?coll=la-home-sports

April 14, 2005
Legend of the Fall
# Before breaking major league baseball's color barrier, Jackie
Robinson was a superb football player at UCLA



By Shav Glick, Times Staff Writer

Ten years before Martin Luther King founded the Southern Christian
Leadership Conference and became an icon in the civil rights movement,
Jackie Robinson was already a trailblazer, opening doors for black
Americans by integrating major league baseball.

Seven years before that, before he'd taken the field as a Brooklyn
Dodger on April 15, 1947, he was a nationally known football player at
UCLA, electrifying fans at the Coliseum with his spectacular
broken-field running, a star halfback on the school's first undefeated
team.

The Coliseum Commission and UCLA will honor his memory today by placing
a plaque in the Coliseum's Memorial Court of Honor. It will honor his
accomplishments in breaking the racial barrier in baseball, his work as
a civil rights exponent and his days as a Bruin, when he became the
only athlete in the school's history to win letters in football,
baseball, basketball and track in the same year.

He will join a diverse group of 46 others, from President Kennedy, Pope
John Paul II and Billy Graham to Kenneth Hahn, Jim Murray, Jesse Owens
and Kenny Washington, Robinson's teammate at UCLA.

Friday will be the Dodgers' turn to honor one of their greatest players
by wearing Brooklyn uniforms in their game against the San Diego Padres
at Dodger Stadium.

Robinson, who died in 1972 at age 53, earned his greatest fame in
baseball, yet "Jackie Robinson" is the answer to one of baseball's most
amazing trivia questions: What player who batted .097 in college later
became National League most valuable player and was voted into the Hall
of Fame on the first ballot?

That was his conference batting average when he left UCLA after playing
only one season of baseball, although he certainly made a lasting first
impression. In his first game as a Bruin, he had four hits and stole
four bases, including home once.

In football, he had a 12.2-yard-per-play average from scrimmage and set
an NCAA record for punt returns in a season; in basketball he led the
Pacific Coast Conference twice in scoring, and in track he won the NCAA
long jump championship - then called the "running broad jump."

Contrasted with that .097 average at UCLA, he had a lifetime average of
.311 with the Dodgers from 1947 to 1956, was major league rookie of the
year in 1947, National League MVP in 1949 and was elected to the Hall
of Fame in 1962. He never played for the Dodgers in the Coliseum in
1958, having retired after the 1956 season, but it was in the Coliseum
that he first caught the nation's attention.

Football brought him into focus at Pasadena City College. His dazzling
running helped put 30,000-40,000 people in the Rose Bowl on Friday
nights, where before attendance had been more like 5,000-6,000. His two
high-scoring seasons got him a scholarship at UCLA, where he attained
the credentials of "a college man" that Branch Rickey set as one of the
standards for finding the right black player to bring into professional
baseball.

It was inevitable that someday the color barrier would be broken, but
Robinson's background made him the chosen one for Rickey's "Noble
Experiment," as his signing was called at the time.

Robinson was the David Copperfield of football. What you saw was an
illusion, not to be believed. After a night game in the Coliseum
against Washington State in 1939, Bob Ray wrote in The Times:

"I still marvel at the way Jackie Robinson evaded three Cougar tacklers
who apparently had him cornered on his first touchdown run. They all
wound up falling flat on their faces, grabbing nothing but night air.
Jackie has more than a change of pace - it's a change of space."

In that game, a 34-26 Bruin victory, Robinson ran for three touchdowns,
passed for another, set up a fifth with an interception and kicked four
extra points.

Hank Shatford, then sports editor of the Daily Bruin, who became a Los
Angeles Superior Court judge, wrote a column headed, "Jackie Robinson
- Better than Red Grange," comparing him to the legendary Illinois
back of the 1920s who scored five touchdowns against undefeated
Michigan, four of them on runs of more than 40 yards.

When Robinson enrolled at UCLA, the Bruins had never had a season with
fewer than two defeats.

Joining the veteran Washington, in his senior year as the Bruins'
career-leading running back, Robinson played wingback in Babe Horrell's
offense in 1939, giving the Bruins the most feared twosome in college
football at the time.

Looking back, it seems amazing that Robinson, who averaged more than 10
yards on every run, had only 10 carries in the first five games.

Against Oregon, in a 16-6 win in front of 45,000 in the Coliseum,
Robinson caught a 66-yard pass from Washington for one touchdown and
ran 83 yards for the other.

Tex Oliver, Oregon's coach, said, "You need mechanized cavalry to stop
him. He runs as fast at three-quarter speed as the average player does
at top speed, and he still has that extra quarter to draw upon."

Doug Fessenden, Montana's coach, said before the Grizzlies' 20-6 loss,
"Robinson had been built up so high in Montana [players'] minds that
they would not have been surprised to see him come out on the field
riding a bicycle."

The season's final game, between undefeated teams in front of a record
103,352 in the Coliseum, would determine which went to the Rose Bowl
game, UCLA or USC. The Bruins had been tied three times, the Trojans
once, so UCLA needed to win to get the bid. They had never played in
the New Year's Day game.

With the score 0-0 and only a few minutes to play, the Bruins had a
first down on the USC three-yard line. Robinson was not given the ball,
though, nor was he called on to kick a short field goal, even though he
had kicked them at Pasadena and had tied the Stanford game with an
extra point.

The play sequence: Washington over left guard, no gain; fullback Leo
Cantor over center, one yard gain; Cantor, one-yard loss; pass from Ned
Matthews to Don McPherson batted down in end zone by Bob Robertson.

Thus, the game ended 0-0 and USC got the Rose Bowl bid.

Asked after the game why Robinson had not been called upon, Horrell
said, "We were using him as a decoy."

Later, at an alumni gathering, the coach was asked why the Bruins
hadn't kicked a field goal with the Rose Bowl bid at stake, giving
Robinson an opportunity to return to the site of his earlier success.

"The game is over, it makes little difference, don't you think?" he
said nonchalantly.

In the dressing room, when the players realized what they had lost in
not going for the win, Robinson said, "Let's play it off in the Rose
Bowl. Why give that $100,000 to some Eastern team?"

When the 1940 season began, it was with high expectations. Washington
had graduated, but Robinson was back.

"His colossallness is almost universal knowledge among football fans
all over the country," Shatford wrote in the Daily Bruin. "The Bruins
should be the greatest drawing card in the nation."

Things didn't work out that way. In the opener against Southern
Methodist, in front of a Coliseum night-record crowd of 70,000,
Robinson returned a punt 87 yards for a touchdown but SMU won, 9-6.
Robinson sat out two games because of injuries, but returned against
Stanford to score on a 43-yard punt return, then threw a 20-yard
scoring pass to Milt Smith. But the Bruins lost, 20-14, against the
Frankie Albert-led team that finished undefeated.

The Bruins finished 1-9 and the only bright spot was Robinson's 21-yard
punt return average, a national record at the time. Shortly after that,
Robinson left school and not long afterward was drafted into the Army.
After the war, he joined the Kansas City Monarchs of the Negro National
League.

It was there that Rickey spotted him. Scouts said he was not the best
player in the league, not even the best of the Monarchs, but had the
ingredient Rickey sought - a college man who had played with and
against integrated teams. Between the 1939 and 1940 football seasons,
Robinson demonstrated the remarkable versatility that prompted many to
call him the greatest all-around athlete in history, including Jim
Thorpe, Bo Jackson, Glenn Davis and Deion Sanders. Busy with baseball,
he did not go out for track until the season was over. With no practice
all season, he won the PCC meet long jump with a then-record jump of 25
feet, and a week later won in the NCAA meet with a 24-10 1/4 leap in
Minneapolis.

Robinson had hoped to compete in the 1940 Olympics in Helsinki, as his
brother Mack had done in 1936 when he was a silver medalist behind
Jesse Owens in the 200 meters at Berlin, but the Games were canceled
after Russia invaded Finland.

Duke Snider, who became a teammate of Robinson with the Dodgers, loves
to tell a story about Jackie when Duke was growing up in Compton.

"Five or six of us kids were watching him play a [junior college]
baseball game when he left in the middle of an inning, trotting over to
compete in the broad jump with his baseball uniform still on, and then
running back and finishing the baseball game as if nothing had
happened."

The Coliseum plaque is the latest in a series of honors being bestowed
belatedly on the young man who grew up on the west side of Pasadena,
where he attended Muir Tech High.

On March 2, he was awarded the Congressional Gold Medal of Honor in a
ceremony at the Capitol Rotunda attended by President Bush. In 1984,
Robinson was awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom by President
Reagan. Time magazine named him one of the 100 most important people of
the century in 1999.

Across from the Pasadena City Hall, he and Mack are memorialized with
nine-foot bronze busts in Centennial Square that were dedicated in
1997.

Today's Coliseum ceremony will start at 2 p.m. with speakers including
William Chadwick, Coliseum Commission president; Albert Carnesale, UCLA
chancellor; Zev Yaroslavsky, county supervisor; Dan Guerrero, UCLA
athletic director; Jamie McCourt, Dodger vice chairman; Don Newcombe,
former Dodger pitcher, and Rachel Robinson, Jackie's widow. Dodger
broadcaster Vin Scully will be master of ceremonies.

*


By the numbers

Some notes on Jackie Robinson's football career:

· Robinson led the country in punt returns in his two seasons at
UCLA, averaging 20.1 yards in 1939 and 21.0 in 1940.

· Robinson averaged an eye-popping 12.2 yards in 42 carries in his
first season, but only 3.64 in his second.

· On Aug. 28, 1941, Robinson caught a 36-yard touchdown pass for the
College All-Stars in a 37-13 loss to the NFL champion Chicago Bears.
"The only time we worried," said Bear end Dick Plasman, "was when that
guy Robinson was on the field."

*
b***@forpresident.com
2005-04-14 23:11:01 UTC
Permalink
Jackie Robinson, after his retirement from baseball, was active in
black Republican
groups and IIRC was appointed to some state office relating to civil
rights by Nelson
Rockefeller. Would it be safe to assume that if Gov. Rockefeller became
President
that Robinson would recieve some appointment on a federal level?
Perhaps on the
Civil Rights Commission, on the President's Council on Physical Fitness
or even
an ambassadorship (probably in the Caribbean)?
Will-Dockery
2024-05-11 18:25:45 UTC
Permalink
Dockery a
Post by Stuart Leichter
"Physical strength put Kerouac at a great advantage. Fro
the age of sixteen, he was blessed with a stocky, muscula
body. He played football at Lowell High School, becoming
town hero and celebrity as he scored touchdown after touchdown
His skill attracted the attention of many prestigious school
aroun
Post by Stuart Leichter
the east coast, and in 1940 Kerouac left Lowell for Columbia
attracte
by its distinguished English department and the big-city life
There
Post by Stuart Leichter
h
injured his right tibia and thus retired his footbal
dreams.
http://archives.waiting-forthe-sun.net/Pages/ArtisticInfluences/Beats/BeatBio
Post by Stuart Leichter
/kerouac_bio.htm
So, WI Kerouac doesn't injure his right tibia, and manages to ge
ove
Post by Stuart Leichter
his disagreements with the coach? Let's say that he manages t
ge
Post by Stuart Leichter
enough of a name for himself at Columbia that he gets drafted b
th
Post by Stuart Leichter
NFL. With so many players off fighting in WW2, he has a chanc
t
Post by Stuart Leichter
prove himself a Big Star, albeit an unmanageable bad boy type
American pro football history in the 1940s is extremely confusin
IMO
Post by Stuart Leichter
with teams and leagues constantly folding and merging. Any idea
o
Post by Stuart Leichter
this one, please
I'm trying to come up with a WI in which Kerouac, upon retirin
fro
Post by Stuart Leichter
football, writes "On The Road" as a footbal
memoir....
Post by Stuart Leichter
And maybe stayed with Maggie
I'm tossing this to the poetry newsgroups, many members of whic
seem t
Post by Stuart Leichter
know more about sports than poetry
Someone might check out Ann Charters' early bio of Kerouac. Sh
als
Post by Stuart Leichter
recorded all of Scott Joplin's works before anyone else had (an
long afte
Post by Stuart Leichter
he'd been forgotten). She also teaches literature at U of Conn o
basketbal
Post by Stuart Leichter
fame a short time ago
Thanks again, Stuart


This is a response to the post seen at
http://www.jlaforums.com/viewtopic.php?p=658314165#65831416

James A. Wolf
2005-04-14 21:15:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@forpresident.com
Post by b***@forpresident.com
Also, the NFL was the first major sports league in the US to
integrate,
Post by b***@forpresident.com
with
Woody Strode playing for the Rams (IIRC one season in Cleveland and
one
Post by b***@forpresident.com
in LA before he retired to go into acting)
Kenny Washington (March 21) several weeks ahead of Woody Strode (May 7)
as first African-American in the NFL since 1933. Washington once kicked
a 73-yard field goal for the (Minor league) Hollywood Bears.
In 1946, there were 4 African Americans who came into pro
football, Strode and Washington were in LA Their signing was part of
the deal to move the Rams to Cleveland. They were both gridiron stars
in Southern California and both past their prime.
In the AAFC Marion Motely and Bill Willis were signed by Paul
Brown in Cleveland. They are enshrined in Canton.
--
<*> James A. Wolf - ***@comcast.net <*>

"The jawbone of an ass is | "We have learned that terrorist attacks are not
just as dangerous a weapon| caused by the use of strength; they are invited
today as in Samson's time | by the perception of weakness."
Richard M. Nixon | George W. Bush
Timothy
2005-04-09 01:35:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@forpresident.com
Also, the NFL was the first major sports league in the US to
integrate,
Post by b***@forpresident.com
with
Woody Strode playing for the Rams (IIRC one season in Cleveland and one
in LA before he retired to go into acting)
The NFL started out integrated when it came into existence in the
1920s. There was even a black head coach, the great Fritz Pollard.
But when the sport began to be a success, blacks were eased out and
didn't get back in until the 1940s.

By Kerouac's time, the NFL was already highly popular, although pro
football didn't overtake baseball and college football in popularity
until the 1950s. Star NFL running backs were major celebrities even in
Kerouac's day. A career as an NFL star would have interfered with
Kerouc's career: he might have still developed his spontaneous bop
prosody, but he wouldn't have been hanging out with the desolation
angels, so it is not clear what he would have written about. (A career
as a journeyman pro footballer, on the other hand, might not have
damaged his development as a writer at all.)

I think it would have taken more than an un-fractured tibia to turn
Kerouac into a NFL running back. He was, judging by the secondhand
evidence available in his biographies, etc., a good player but not a
superstar. And although Columbia's programs was much more prestigious
in Kerouac's time than it is now, the Lions were not really a major
national power (although Lou Little was a Hall of Fame coach and the
team did win a Rose Bowl in the 1930s.)

Also, he might have resumed his football career even after breaking his
leg. There were a whole number of factors which ended his career--- he
didn't get along with his coach, he became interested in other things,
he developed what would now be described as a "substance abuse problem"
and World War II happened.
Doubting Timus
2005-04-09 03:22:14 UTC
Permalink
If Kerouac could've made it beyond Horace Mann, then so could Neal Cassady.
Remember the games down in Algiers (LA) in Road when they were doing
impromtu footraces and Neal ran away from him. Also Cassady called himself
in letters the greatest 70 yard passer in the history of Colorado reform
school. According to Visions of Cody, he could pass long and then go
retrieve it, which is maybe another reason why the canon of Kerouac is on
the fiction shelves.

The wise old heads claim the 1958 NFL champeenship, Colts over the Giants in
sudden death overtime, was the best of all time. It seemed fairly ordinary
by current standards. (On film, it looks like a good high school game from
the perspective of today.) It is also called the White Boy Bowl, which may
be a factor in its popularity among the ancients.

In the fifites, the NFL was on TV every Sunday during the season, and every
Sunday it was the Bears against somebody. Every Sunday, and the announcer
was Red Grange, and his constant byline was, after every extra point, "The
clock is stopped on the field, with the score - "

Joe Fortunata. Bibbles Baughel. I do not remember a single black player on
any Sunday.
--
Doubting Timus
ubi dubium ibi libertas
***@nerdnosh.com
Stuart Leichter
2005-04-09 04:02:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Doubting Timus
If Kerouac could've made it beyond Horace Mann, then so could Neal Cassady.
Remember the games down in Algiers (LA) in Road when they were doing
impromtu footraces and Neal ran away from him. Also Cassady called himself
in letters the greatest 70 yard passer in the history of Colorado reform
school. According to Visions of Cody, he could pass long and then go
retrieve it, which is maybe another reason why the canon of Kerouac is on
the fiction shelves.
The wise old heads claim the 1958 NFL champeenship, Colts over the Giants in
sudden death overtime, was the best of all time. It seemed fairly ordinary
by current standards. (On film, it looks like a good high school game from
the perspective of today.) It is also called the White Boy Bowl, which may
be a factor in its popularity among the ancients.
In the fifites, the NFL was on TV every Sunday during the season, and every
Sunday it was the Bears against somebody. Every Sunday, and the announcer
was Red Grange, and his constant byline was, after every extra point, "The
clock is stopped on the field, with the score - "
Joe Fortunata. Bibbles Baughel. I do not remember a single black player on
any Sunday.
Jim Brown remembers, Sam Huff also remembers.
Will Dockery
2005-04-10 06:31:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stuart Leichter
Post by Doubting Timus
If Kerouac could've made it beyond Horace Mann, then so could Neal Cassady.
Remember the games down in Algiers (LA) in Road when they were doing
impromtu footraces and Neal ran away from him. Also Cassady called himself
in letters the greatest 70 yard passer in the history of Colorado reform
school. According to Visions of Cody, he could pass long and then go
retrieve it, which is maybe another reason why the canon of Kerouac is on
the fiction shelves.
The wise old heads claim the 1958 NFL champeenship, Colts over the Giants in
sudden death overtime, was the best of all time. It seemed fairly ordinary
by current standards. (On film, it looks like a good high school game from
the perspective of today.) It is also called the White Boy Bowl, which may
be a factor in its popularity among the ancients.
In the fifites, the NFL was on TV every Sunday during the season, and every
Sunday it was the Bears against somebody. Every Sunday, and the announcer
was Red Grange, and his constant byline was, after every extra point, "The
clock is stopped on the field, with the score - "
Joe Fortunata. Bibbles Baughel. I do not remember a single black player on
any Sunday.
Jim Brown remembers
"Tick... Tick... Tick..." to "Slaughter".

If Kerouac had aced George Peppard to play himself in "Subterraneans",
then to a run as Buzz Murdock on "Route 66", and left some of the
excess behind, could he have later led the A-Team?

--
"I saw a werewolf drinkin' a pina colada at Trader Vic's
And his hair was perfect." -Warren Zevon

The Netherlands/Shadowville cross cultural exchange
project <http://www.kannibaal.nl/shadowville.htm>

Autograph Of Zorro" {from *Shadowville Live*}:
<http://www.kannibaal.nl/zorro.mp3>
General Zod
2019-11-13 00:42:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
"Physical strength put Kerouac at a great advantage. From
the age of sixteen, he was blessed with a stocky, muscular
body. He played football at Lowell High School, becoming a
town hero and celebrity as he scored touchdown after touchdown.
His skill attracted the attention of many prestigious schools
around
the east coast, and in 1940 Kerouac left Lowell for Columbia,
attracted
by its distinguished English department and the big-city life.
There,
he
injured his right tibia and thus retired his football dreams."
http://archives.waiting-forthe-sun.net/Pages/ArtisticInfluences/Beats/BeatBios/kerouac_bio.html
So, WI Kerouac doesn't injure his right tibia, and manages to get
over
his disagreements with the coach? Let's say that he manages to
get
enough of a name for himself at Columbia that he gets drafted by
the
NFL. With so many players off fighting in WW2, he has a chance to
prove himself a Big Star, albeit an unmanageable bad boy type.
American pro football history in the 1940s is extremely confusing
IMO,
with teams and leagues constantly folding and merging. Any ideas
on
this one, please?
I'm trying to come up with a WI in which Kerouac, upon retiring
from
football, writes "On The Road" as a football memoir.....
If Whizzer White can become a Supreme Court justice, Keroac can play
football.
Did the NFL even exist in 1945? Pro football was small time until
about 1960 and even then it wasn't much. It was mostly guys who
liked
to play and were insurance agents and stuff like that in the off
season
to make a living, and pro football was dwarfed by the college game.
The Columbia football team might have been hot stuff then.
There was an article in Sports Illustrated way back when that described
Kerouac's reaction to the football coach at Columbia. The google says
Lou Little was coach who would not play Kerouac.
The NFL was not much in 1945, having teams like the PHil-Pitts formed
from the Philadelphia Eagles and Pittsburgh Steelers to save travel
money. By 1946 when the All-American Conference (Cleveland Browns, San
Francisco 49ers, etc) formed a small salary war had started. There were
teams in Los Angeles and Miami where the glamour was greater. The LA
Ram quarterback Bob Waterfield married Jane Russel and things started
looking up.
But unless Kerouac was as good as he thought he was and escaped injury
he would have been a flash in the pan.
I'd like to find that article......
Zod The Mighty
2019-11-14 02:41:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
"Physical strength put Kerouac at a great advantage. From
the age of sixteen, he was blessed with a stocky, muscular
body. He played football at Lowell High School, becoming a
town hero and celebrity as he scored touchdown after touchdown.
His skill attracted the attention of many prestigious schools
around
the east coast, and in 1940 Kerouac left Lowell for Columbia,
attracted
by its distinguished English department and the big-city life.
There,
he
injured his right tibia and thus retired his football dreams."
http://archives.waiting-forthe-sun.net/Pages/ArtisticInfluences/Beats/BeatBios/kerouac_bio.html
So, WI Kerouac doesn't injure his right tibia, and manages to get
over
his disagreements with the coach? Let's say that he manages to
get
enough of a name for himself at Columbia that he gets drafted by
the
NFL. With so many players off fighting in WW2, he has a chance to
prove himself a Big Star, albeit an unmanageable bad boy type.
American pro football history in the 1940s is extremely confusing
IMO,
with teams and leagues constantly folding and merging. Any ideas
on
this one, please?
I'm trying to come up with a WI in which Kerouac, upon retiring
from
football, writes "On The Road" as a football memoir.....
If Whizzer White can become a Supreme Court justice, Keroac can play
football.
Did the NFL even exist in 1945? Pro football was small time until
about 1960 and even then it wasn't much. It was mostly guys who
liked
to play and were insurance agents and stuff like that in the off
season
to make a living, and pro football was dwarfed by the college game.
The Columbia football team might have been hot stuff then.
There was an article in Sports Illustrated way back when that described
Kerouac's reaction to the football coach at Columbia. The google says
Lou Little was coach who would not play Kerouac.
The NFL was not much in 1945, having teams like the PHil-Pitts formed
from the Philadelphia Eagles and Pittsburgh Steelers to save travel
money. By 1946 when the All-American Conference (Cleveland Browns, San
Francisco 49ers, etc) formed a small salary war had started. There were
teams in Los Angeles and Miami where the glamour was greater. The LA
Ram quarterback Bob Waterfield married Jane Russel and things started
looking up.
But unless Kerouac was as good as he thought he was and escaped injury
he would have been a flash in the pan.


Jack (Vincent Balestri) tells his new friends about his football days at Columbia University, and how he "decided to become a Beethoven instead of an athlete."
Z***@none.i2p
2019-11-14 23:32:54 UTC
Permalink
"Physical strength put Kerouac at a great advantage. From[/color]
Post by Will Dockery
the age of sixteen, he was blessed with a stocky, muscular
body. He played football at Lowell High School, becoming a
town hero and celebrity as he scored touchdown after touchdown.
His skill attracted the attention of many prestigious schools
around
the east coast, and in 1940 Kerouac left Lowell for Columbia,
attracted
by its distinguished English department and the big-city life.
There,
he
injured his right tibia and thus retired his football dreams."
http://archives.waiting-forthe-sun.net/Pages/ArtisticInfluences/Beats/BeatBios/kerouac_bio.html
So, WI Kerouac doesn't injure his right tibia, and manages to get
over
his disagreements with the coach? Let's say that he manages to
get
enough of a name for himself at Columbia that he gets drafted by
the
NFL. With so many players off fighting in WW2, he has a chance to
prove himself a Big Star, albeit an unmanageable bad boy type.
American pro football history in the 1940s is extremely confusing
IMO,
with teams and leagues constantly folding and merging. Any ideas
on
this one, please?
I'm trying to come up with a WI in which Kerouac, upon retiring
from
football, writes "On The Road" as a football memoir.....
If Whizzer White can become a Supreme Court justice, Keroac can play
football.
Did the NFL even exist in 1945? Pro football was small time until
about 1960 and even then it wasn't much. It was mostly guys who
liked
to play and were insurance agents and stuff like that in the off
season
to make a living, and pro football was dwarfed by the college game.
The Columbia football team might have been hot stuff then.
There was an article in Sports Illustrated way back when that described
Kerouac's reaction to the football coach at Columbia. The google says
Lou Little was coach who would not play Kerouac.
The NFL was not much in 1945, having teams like the PHil-Pitts formed
from the Philadelphia Eagles and Pittsburgh Steelers to save travel
money. By 1946 when the All-American Conference (Cleveland Browns, San
Francisco 49ers, etc) formed a small salary war had started. There were
teams in Los Angeles and Miami where the glamour was greater. The LA
Ram quarterback Bob Waterfield married Jane Russel and things started
looking up.
But unless Kerouac was as good as he thought he was and escaped injury
he would have been a flash in the pan.
http://youtu.be/OX26e0EG2xY

Jack (Vincent Balestri) tells his new friends about his football days at Columbia University, and how he "decided to become a Beethoven instead of an athlete."[/quote]

Interesting, having second read...............
James A. Wolf
2005-04-14 21:23:51 UTC
Permalink
One thing I like about this WI is that idt does allow
flexibility. The pay in the NFL until the 60s forced gridders to take
second jobs, even the stars. 'Concrete Charlie' Bednerik got his name
because he sold concrete in the off-season. So, maybe Jack gets a job
as a writer or reporter. This begs the question of what the NFL rules
were about players writing as journalists.

Now, what?
--
<*> James A. Wolf - ***@comcast.net <*>

"The jawbone of an ass is | "We have learned that terrorist attacks are not
just as dangerous a weapon| caused by the use of strength; they are invited
today as in Samson's time | by the perception of weakness."
Richard M. Nixon | George W. Bush
Jack Linthicum
2005-04-14 22:47:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by James A. Wolf
One thing I like about this WI is that idt does allow
flexibility. The pay in the NFL until the 60s forced gridders to take
second jobs, even the stars. 'Concrete Charlie' Bednerik got his name
because he sold concrete in the off-season. So, maybe Jack gets a job
as a writer or reporter. This begs the question of what the NFL rules
were about players writing as journalists.
Now, what?
--
<*>
Post by James A. Wolf
"The jawbone of an ass is | "We have learned that terrorist attacks are not
just as dangerous a weapon| caused by the use of strength; they are invited
today as in Samson's time | by the perception of weakness."
Richard M. Nixon |
George W. Bush

One side of the flexibility is that Kerouac can get a job doing jock
stype stuff for a studio and start making comments about how the script
makes his (minor) character or stunt object not realistic. He is asked
to sit down with a secretary and narrate his ideas, the secertary likes
the stuff and suggests he be hired a writer. He meets Kesey on location
and they start off on the Dharma road.
Will Dockery
2005-04-18 18:53:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by James A. Wolf
Post by James A. Wolf
One thing I like about this WI is that idt does allow
flexibility. The pay in the NFL until the 60s forced gridders to
take
Post by James A. Wolf
second jobs, even the stars. 'Concrete Charlie' Bednerik got his
name
Post by James A. Wolf
because he sold concrete in the off-season. So, maybe Jack gets a
job
Post by James A. Wolf
as a writer or reporter. This begs the question of what the NFL
rules
Post by James A. Wolf
were about players writing as journalists.
Now, what?
--
<*>
Post by James A. Wolf
"The jawbone of an ass is | "We have learned that terrorist attacks
are not
Post by James A. Wolf
just as dangerous a weapon| caused by the use of strength; they are
invited
Post by James A. Wolf
today as in Samson's time | by the perception of weakness."
Richard M. Nixon |
George W. Bush
One side of the flexibility is that Kerouac can get a job doing jock
stype stuff for a studio and start making comments about how the script
makes his (minor) character or stunt object not realistic. He is asked
to sit down with a secretary and narrate his ideas, the secertary likes
the stuff and suggests he be hired a writer. He meets Kesey on
location
Post by James A. Wolf
and they start off on the Dharma road.
And by meeting Kesey under very different circumstances, without the
experiences of the Beat era that through these twists never happened
that had him "soured" on counter-culture and the emerging "hippie"
direction things took, he may have taken an active though not
antagonistic part in the events that followed.
----
From: Christopher Jamison
Subject: Re: ? Beat movement end
View: Complete Thread (8 articles)
Newsgroups: alt.books.beatgeneration
Date: 1999/05/20
Post by James A. Wolf
I was wondering when people would say the Beat movement ended?
I realize this is probably not that simple a question, but any
related
Post by James A. Wolf
response would be appreciated.
The Beat movement ended the night Ken Kesey and the Merry Pranksters
arrived in New York City and no one but Kesey paid attention to
Kerouac.
Ginsberg and Burroughs and all the rest continued, but it was no longer
Beat. They were beats but there weren't any more beats. Now there
were
hippies. Paul Perry wrote a terriffic book of oral history called _On
the
Bus_ about Kesey and the Pranksters that explains this night in detail.

Basically, they hooked up with Ginsberg, Kesey wanted to meet Kerouac.
Kerouac was by that time doing his fifth of Johnny Walker a day plus
pills
routine. When Kerouac entered, he noticed that the Pranksters had an
American flag draped haphazardly over the couch. Kerouac quietly and
sadly
folded it properly and sat with it in his lap for the rest of the
night.
Kesey was pretty much the only one who talked to him. That is the
night
the Beat Generation ended.

Sarah
----

*But*, if the Beat Generation had never happened, and if Kerouac and
Kesey had met without all that baggage, and without the influence
*that* had had on Kesey, the meeting would certainly been much
different, as well as more natural.

And they both may have still been with us today.

--
"Sea Weed Fox" [Will Dockery]
http://www.lulu.com/items/36000/36412/preview/Irony_Waves_-_Track__8.mp3

"Karma Bombs" [Will Dockery]
http://www.lulu.com/items/32000/32109/preview/Karma_Bombs.mp3
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