Discussion:
Wisconsin lockdown ruled unconstitutional
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George J. Dance
2020-05-18 15:55:35 UTC
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Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.

Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
Rocky
2020-05-18 19:14:38 UTC
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George J. Dance wrote on Mon, 18 May 2020 15:55
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
Interesting.... they seem to be tight up that way....
George J. Dance
2020-05-18 21:41:30 UTC
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Post by Rocky
George J. Dance wrote on Mon, 18 May 2020 15:55
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
Interesting.... they seem to be tight up that way....
New cases are higher than in April, and they'll probably go higher still. OTOH, the state had 0 deaths yesterday, for the first time in two months.
Z***@none.i2p
2020-05-18 22:44:58 UTC
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George J. Dance wrote on Mon, 18 May 2020 21:41
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rocky
George J. Dance wrote on Mon, 18 May 2020 15:55
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
Interesting.... they seem to be tight up that way....
New cases are higher than in April, and they'll probably go higher still. OTOH, the state had 0 deaths yesterday, for the first time in two months.
Seem to be holding steady down this way....
Rocky
2020-05-22 00:29:43 UTC
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Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rocky
George J. Dance wrote on Mon, 18 May 2020 15:55
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
Interesting.... they seem to be tight up that way....
New cases are higher than in April, and they'll probably go higher still. OTOH, the state had 0 deaths yesterday, for the first time in two months.
Indeed....
Zod
2020-05-23 18:36:00 UTC
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I hope all is well up your way today, Philo.....
General Zod
2020-06-15 00:30:02 UTC
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Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rocky
George J. Dance wrote on Mon, 18 May 2020 15:55
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
Interesting.... they seem to be tight up that way....
New cases are higher than in April, and they'll probably go higher still. OTOH, the state had 0 deaths yesterday, for the first time in two months.
Disturbing times....
George J. Dance
2020-06-15 01:17:06 UTC
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Post by General Zod
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rocky
George J. Dance wrote on Mon, 18 May 2020 15:55
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
Interesting.... they seem to be tight up that way....
New cases are higher than in April, and they'll probably go higher still. OTOH, the state had 0 deaths yesterday, for the first time in two months.
Disturbing times....
Fortunately, a month later, there seem to have been enough people socially distancing voluntarily that infections and deaths have not spiked.

https://gdspoliticalanimal.blogspot.com/2020/06/voluntary-social-distancing-working-in.html

The same in Georgia.
Zod
2020-06-15 01:32:00 UTC
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Post by George J. Dance
Post by General Zod
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rocky
George J. Dance wrote on Mon, 18 May 2020 15:55
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
Interesting.... they seem to be tight up that way....
New cases are higher than in April, and they'll probably go higher still. OTOH, the state had 0 deaths yesterday, for the first time in two months.
Disturbing times....
Fortunately, a month later, there seem to have been enough people socially distancing voluntarily that infections and deaths have not spiked.
https://gdspoliticalanimal.blogspot.com/2020/06/voluntary-social-distancing-working-in.html
The same in Georgia.
In this area of Georgia almost everything is closed by 9pm...

I have heard some bars and nightclubs have opened, but I have not checked, as this is a non-drinking phase I have been in the past few weeks...
George J. Dance
2020-06-18 17:01:26 UTC
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Post by Zod
Post by George J. Dance
Post by General Zod
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rocky
George J. Dance wrote on Mon, 18 May 2020 15:55
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
Interesting.... they seem to be tight up that way....
New cases are higher than in April, and they'll probably go higher still. OTOH, the state had 0 deaths yesterday, for the first time in two months.
Disturbing times....
Fortunately, a month later, there seem to have been enough people socially distancing voluntarily that infections and deaths have not spiked.
https://gdspoliticalanimal.blogspot.com/2020/06/voluntary-social-distancing-working-in.html
The same in Georgia.
In this area of Georgia almost everything is closed by 9pm...
I expect a lot of new rules like that, as well as arbitrary changes in them, even if the state's not calling the shots. Some stores will reduce hours and staff, others will limit customers inside, others require masks. There's going to still be higher-than-usual unemployment; on the other hand, there'll be a lot of new job opportunities in things like city-wide delivery. The important thing is, Georgia's economy isn't wrecked (nor is Wisconsin's, thanks to the partisan politics there) - it looks like those states have missed the worst of it.
Post by Zod
I have heard some bars and nightclubs have opened, but I have not checked, as this is a non-drinking phase I have been in the past few weeks...
Congratulations; I'm proud of you. Just to give my own experience, I find I can't give up something all that easily; I need something else to fill the internal void instead. I hope you have something like that - you did mention getting back into painting.
Zod
2020-06-18 17:06:00 UTC
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Post by George J. Dance
Post by Zod
Post by George J. Dance
Post by General Zod
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rocky
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
Interesting.... they seem to be tight up that way....
New cases are higher than in April, and they'll probably go higher still. OTOH, the state had 0 deaths yesterday, for the first time in two months.
Disturbing times....
Fortunately, a month later, there seem to have been enough people socially distancing voluntarily that infections and deaths have not spiked.
https://gdspoliticalanimal.blogspot.com/2020/06/voluntary-social-distancing-working-in.html
The same in Georgia.
In this area of Georgia almost everything is closed by 9pm...
I expect a lot of new rules like that, as well as arbitrary changes in them, even if the state's not calling the shots. Some stores will reduce hours and staff, others will limit customers inside, others require masks. There's going to still be higher-than-usual unemployment; on the other hand, there'll be a lot of new job opportunities in things like city-wide delivery. The important thing is, Georgia's economy isn't wrecked (nor is Wisconsin's, thanks to the partisan politics there) - it looks like those states have missed the worst of it.
Post by Zod
I have heard some bars and nightclubs have opened, but I have not checked, as this is a non-drinking phase I have been in the past few weeks...
Congratulations; I'm proud of you. Just to give my own experience, I find I can't give up something all that easily; I need something else to fill the internal void instead. I hope you have something like that - you did mention getting back into painting.
Well... I have been... gardening...

Plants are looking good, nice and tall with some buds developing....

Ha ha ha...
George J. Dance
2020-06-18 17:40:38 UTC
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Post by Zod
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Zod
Post by George J. Dance
Post by General Zod
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rocky
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
Interesting.... they seem to be tight up that way....
New cases are higher than in April, and they'll probably go higher still. OTOH, the state had 0 deaths yesterday, for the first time in two months.
Disturbing times....
Fortunately, a month later, there seem to have been enough people socially distancing voluntarily that infections and deaths have not spiked.
https://gdspoliticalanimal.blogspot.com/2020/06/voluntary-social-distancing-working-in.html
The same in Georgia.
In this area of Georgia almost everything is closed by 9pm...
I expect a lot of new rules like that, as well as arbitrary changes in them, even if the state's not calling the shots. Some stores will reduce hours and staff, others will limit customers inside, others require masks. There's going to still be higher-than-usual unemployment; on the other hand, there'll be a lot of new job opportunities in things like city-wide delivery. The important thing is, Georgia's economy isn't wrecked (nor is Wisconsin's, thanks to the partisan politics there) - it looks like those states have missed the worst of it.
Post by Zod
I have heard some bars and nightclubs have opened, but I have not checked, as this is a non-drinking phase I have been in the past few weeks...
Congratulations; I'm proud of you. Just to give my own experience, I find I can't give up something all that easily; I need something else to fill the internal void instead. I hope you have something like that - you did mention getting back into painting.
Well... I have been... gardening...
Plants are looking good, nice and tall with some buds developing....
Ha ha ha...
LOL! No wonder you've been so eager for Pastor Corey to return.
Zod
2020-06-18 19:29:00 UTC
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Post by George J. Dance
Post by Zod
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Zod
Post by George J. Dance
Post by General Zod
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rocky
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
Interesting.... they seem to be tight up that way....
New cases are higher than in April, and they'll probably go higher still. OTOH, the state had 0 deaths yesterday, for the first time in two months.
Disturbing times....
Fortunately, a month later, there seem to have been enough people socially distancing voluntarily that infections and deaths have not spiked.
https://gdspoliticalanimal.blogspot.com/2020/06/voluntary-social-distancing-working-in.html
The same in Georgia.
In this area of Georgia almost everything is closed by 9pm...
I expect a lot of new rules like that, as well as arbitrary changes in them, even if the state's not calling the shots. Some stores will reduce hours and staff, others will limit customers inside, others require masks. There's going to still be higher-than-usual unemployment; on the other hand, there'll be a lot of new job opportunities in things like city-wide delivery. The important thing is, Georgia's economy isn't wrecked (nor is Wisconsin's, thanks to the partisan politics there) - it looks like those states have missed the worst of it.
Post by Zod
I have heard some bars and nightclubs have opened, but I have not checked, as this is a non-drinking phase I have been in the past few weeks...
Congratulations; I'm proud of you. Just to give my own experience, I find I can't give up something all that easily; I need something else to fill the internal void instead. I hope you have something like that - you did mention getting back into painting.
Well... I have been... gardening...
Plants are looking good, nice and tall with some buds developing....
Ha ha ha...
LOL! No wonder you've been so eager for Pastor Corey to return.
Alas, Poor Corey, I knew him well....
Zod
2020-06-18 21:37:00 UTC
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Update on Minneapolis: I spent time at 38th and Chicago last weekend. The streets around the area were blocked off. It was peaceful, a lot like the Haight, back in the day. There are two murals and hundreds of bouquets. There were no police in sight.
During the protests, the police were slashing the tires along the protest routes. They were also tasoring people on their own property, saying, "light them up." This in an area where there was already unending and profound police brutality. There were also rumors and indications of small groups of anarchists going to various suburban locals, such as shopping malls. Fortunately, these things did not happen.
I traveled back on Lake Street. It is a war zone. Some buildings are just rubble. Everything else is boarded up. Fortunately, there is a generous anonymous donor who is providing funds for these businesses to get up and running. It is going to be difficult though. Groups have stepped in to provide food and necessities for those using those stores. At one church they had over 1K bags of food.
Pamela
Reposted for Philo, stay safe up there my friend...
Zod
2020-06-19 09:14:00 UTC
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updated analysis at https://dylagence.wordpress.com/
Pamela
I have just updated Deconstructing Murder Most Foul to include a link to Bob Dylan's interview on RARW and the murder of George Floyd.
Way to go, Mr. Dylan. The world listens to you.
https://dylagence.wordpress.com/2020/04/09/deconstructing-murder-most-foul-were-a-j-weberman-and-david-icke-among-the-sources-bob-dylan-used/
Pamela
dylagence.wordpress.com
Did you march or rally with us today or any day during these Days of Awakening?
Because of the level of danger and the unjust police treatment of the peaceful protesters I have not yet gone out to march, but will look for opportunities to do that now that things are more sane. I am in awe of those of you who did.
https://theothermozart.wordpress.com/2020/06/10/a-small-tribute-to-george-floyd-from-minneapolis/
Pamela
Quite good...
Tomorrow there will be Juneteenth celebrations all day at 38th and Chicago, as well as at other sites in that area.
Passing word on to my friend Philo, who lives in the area...
philo
2020-05-22 01:00:25 UTC
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My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.

As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.

The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Z***@none.i2p
2020-05-22 01:43:35 UTC
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Philip Kassner wrote on Fri, 22 May 2020 01:00
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Good to see you Philo....

Glad life seems good up your way,,,,,
Will Dockery
2020-05-28 19:23:57 UTC
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Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Art of
2020-05-28 20:18:01 UTC
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Post by Will Dockery
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Staying off the stage is the best thing you ever did for the Columbus area music scene.
Doc was shunned from joining others on the stage before Corona so the joke is on you.
Zod
2020-05-28 20:26:00 UTC
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Doc was xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Ha, you are a quick one today, you obsessive parasite....
George J. Dance
2020-05-29 09:25:08 UTC
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Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.

I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.

i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Will Dockery
2020-05-29 18:09:44 UTC
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Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.

They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
ME
2020-05-29 18:15:53 UTC
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Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Will Dockery
2020-05-29 18:38:17 UTC
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Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
ME
2020-05-29 18:46:42 UTC
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Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
Will Dockery
2020-05-29 18:52:39 UTC
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Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.

I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
ME
2020-05-29 19:10:41 UTC
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Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
There is no books a million in Columbus anymore.
Rocky
2020-06-03 00:25:55 UTC
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Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
I went to 2nd and Chalres today, cool store...
Will Dockery
2020-06-03 19:37:38 UTC
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Post by Rocky
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
I went to 2nd and Chalres today, cool store...
Agreed. I spend hours in there reading the books and don't have to spend a dime.
NancyGene
2020-06-03 19:51:55 UTC
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Post by Will Dockery
Post by Rocky
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
I went to 2nd and Chalres today, cool store...
Agreed. I spend hours in there reading the books and don't have to spend a dime.
Do they want you hanging around for hours, reading their books, and not buying anything? Isn't that loitering? Also, how can they stay in business if you read their books, putting them into a less saleable condition, and then buy nothing?
Will Dockery
2020-06-03 20:12:49 UTC
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Post by NancyGene
Post by Rocky
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
I went to 2nd and Chalres today, cool store...
<forgery snipped>
Post by NancyGene
Do they want
<snip>

You were fooled by an impostor troll (you?) again, Nancy G.

;)
NancyGene
2020-06-03 20:27:24 UTC
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Post by Will Dockery
Post by NancyGene
Post by Rocky
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
I went to 2nd and Chalres today, cool store...
Do they want you hanging around for hours, reading their books, and not buying anything? Isn't that loitering? Also, how can they stay in business if you read their books, putting them into a less saleable condition, and then buy nothing?
You were fooled by an impostor troll (you?) again, Nancy G.
The imposters tell the truth, are much better writers than you are, and are more entertaining. Carry on, imposters!
Will Dockery
2020-06-03 20:34:46 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by NancyGene
Post by Will Dockery
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
I went to 2nd and Charles today, cool store...
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Post by NancyGene
Post by Will Dockery
You were fooled by an impostor troll (you?) again, Nancy G.
The imposters tell
<troll snip>

Since you're an impostor yourself, it is expected that you would defend them.

Or perhaps you /are/ the impostor?

;)
Dental River
2020-06-03 23:20:55 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by NancyGene
Post by Will Dockery
Post by NancyGene
Post by Rocky
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
I went to 2nd and Chalres today, cool store...
Do they want you hanging around for hours, reading their books, and not buying anything? Isn't that loitering? Also, how can they stay in business if you read their books, putting them into a less saleable condition, and then buy nothing?
You were fooled by an impostor troll (you?) again, Nancy G.
The imposters tell the truth, are much better writers than you are, and are more entertaining. Carry on, imposters!
Will should thank God he has talented imposters, who in the future might become confused with the unfortunate real Will, and raise his currency considerably.
NancyGene
2020-06-03 23:30:56 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dental River
Post by NancyGene
Post by Will Dockery
Post by NancyGene
Post by Rocky
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
I went to 2nd and Chalres today, cool store...
Do they want you hanging around for hours, reading their books, and not buying anything? Isn't that loitering? Also, how can they stay in business if you read their books, putting them into a less saleable condition, and then buy nothing?
You were fooled by an impostor troll (you?) again, Nancy G.
The imposters tell the truth, are much better writers than you are, and are more entertaining. Carry on, imposters!
Will should thank God he has talented imposters, who in the future might become confused with the unfortunate real Will, and raise his currency considerably.
Therefore, Dental River, is it your advice to Will to not write another word and just let his imposters write for him? That seems reasonable. His imposters are witty, winsome and untoword.
Dental River
2020-06-03 23:43:27 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by NancyGene
Post by Dental River
Post by NancyGene
Post by Will Dockery
Post by NancyGene
Post by Rocky
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
I went to 2nd and Chalres today, cool store...
Do they want you hanging around for hours, reading their books, and not buying anything? Isn't that loitering? Also, how can they stay in business if you read their books, putting them into a less saleable condition, and then buy nothing?
You were fooled by an impostor troll (you?) again, Nancy G.
The imposters tell the truth, are much better writers than you are, and are more entertaining. Carry on, imposters!
Will should thank God he has talented imposters, who in the future might become confused with the unfortunate real Will, and raise his currency considerably.
Therefore, Dental River, is it your advice to Will to not write another word and just let his imposters write for him? That seems reasonable. His imposters are witty, winsome and untoword.
Yes, it's like hiring and training a class of Santa Clauses to go out and find employment as Santa. Only a modicum of ability is required- and sobriety. The real Santa is an unseemly thing, derived from druid lore, frightening to children. Rosy-cheeked Santa impostors perform a far greater service to the world.

No one needs to meet the real thing, after all.
Rocky
2020-06-03 23:53:20 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Yes, it's like xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Shut up, you scumbag impostor troll.....
Dental River
2020-06-04 00:01:04 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Yes, it's like xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
You make everything sound dirty.
Rocky
2020-06-04 00:05:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dental River
Yes, it's like xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
You make everything sound dirty.
Go wash your eyes out, fuck head....
Rocky
2020-06-03 23:52:34 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Therefore, Dental River, is it your advice to Will xxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

As if Doc would need advice from a scumbag troll such as Barry.....
Will Dockery
2020-06-03 20:10:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
Post by Rocky
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
I went to 2nd and Chalres today, cool store...
Agreed
<troll snip>

Fuck off, identity thief.

;)
ME
2020-05-29 19:03:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
ME
2020-05-29 21:00:15 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
Wil......can’t you read?
I stated that I checked and second and Charles books Did Not Close.
Please read my entire posts at least once before responding.
It would help you look less foolish.
Will Dockery
2020-05-29 22:25:24 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
And you found out I was correct, so all is good.
Post by ME
Post by ME
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
Wil......can’t you read?
I stated that I checked and second and Charles books Did Not Close.
I know.

I made a statement, you didn't believe me so you made phone calls and found out that I was correct, after all.

No reason to respond, glad to clear up your confusion and doubt.

;)
ME
2020-05-29 22:56:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
And you found out I was correct, so all is good.
Post by ME
Post by ME
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
Wil......can’t you read?
I stated that I checked and second and Charles books Did Not Close.
I know.
I made a statement, you didn't believe me so you made phone calls and found out that I was correct, after all.
No reason to respond, glad to clear up your confusion and doubt.
;)
Ok, will, the one in Alabama shut down for a week. The one in Columbus, did not, for reasons that remain perplexing to ME.
I had no confusion, which is your go to slur against ME. Which, once again, backfired on you and made you look like a dumb ass.
Besides, it’s not like you could have gone to either of the stores you’ve referred to actually purchase anything. Unless they have a dollar bin somewhere.
Will Dockery
2020-05-29 23:03:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
And you found out I was correct, so all is good.
Post by ME
Post by ME
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
Wil......can’t you read?
I stated that I checked and second and Charles books Did Not Close.
I know.
I made a statement, you didn't believe me so you made phone calls and found out that I was correct, after all.
No reason to respond, glad to clear up your confusion and doubt.
;)
Ok, will, the one in Alabama shut down for a week. The one in Columbus, did not
I already know they were both open, I was not aware that the Books-A-Million closed for a week but I was aware that the Columbus GA lication of 2nd & Charles never closed.

Here, check them all and see which locations stayed open and which closed, it may have been a company policy:

http://www.2ndandcharles.com/locations/

"Want to get in touch with a 2nd & Charles near you? Find a store by clicking on your state and city, and contact via phone according to store hours..."
ME
2020-05-29 23:05:43 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
And you found out I was correct, so all is good.
Post by ME
Post by ME
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
Wil......can’t you read?
I stated that I checked and second and Charles books Did Not Close.
I know.
I made a statement, you didn't believe me so you made phone calls and found out that I was correct, after all.
No reason to respond, glad to clear up your confusion and doubt.
;)
Ok, will, the one in Alabama shut down for a week. The one in Columbus, did not
I already know they were both open, I was not aware that the Books-A-Million closed for a week but I was aware that the Columbus GA lication of 2nd & Charles never closed.
http://www.2ndandcharles.com/locations/
"Want to get in touch with a 2nd & Charles near you? Find a store by clicking on your state and city, and contact via phone according to store hours..."
Oh will, you need not worry. I know how to fact check.
Will Dockery
2020-05-29 23:11:03 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
And you found out I was correct, so all is good.
Post by ME
Post by ME
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
Wil......can’t you read?
I stated that I checked and second and Charles books Did Not Close.
I know.
I made a statement, you didn't believe me so you made phone calls and found out that I was correct, after all.
No reason to respond, glad to clear up your confusion and doubt.
;)
Ok, will, the one in Alabama shut down for a week. The one in Columbus, did not
I already know they were both open, I was not aware that the Books-A-Million closed for a week but I was aware that the Columbus GA lication of 2nd & Charles never closed.
http://www.2ndandcharles.com/locations/
"Want to get in touch with a 2nd & Charles near you? Find a store by clicking on your state and city, and contact via phone according to store hours..."
Oh will, you need not worry. I know how to fact check.
Go ahead, then... make your stalking useful for a change.

;)
ME
2020-05-29 23:13:17 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
And you found out I was correct, so all is good.
Post by ME
Post by ME
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
Wil......can’t you read?
I stated that I checked and second and Charles books Did Not Close.
I know.
I made a statement, you didn't believe me so you made phone calls and found out that I was correct, after all.
No reason to respond, glad to clear up your confusion and doubt.
;)
Ok, will, the one in Alabama shut down for a week. The one in Columbus, did not
I already know they were both open, I was not aware that the Books-A-Million closed for a week but I was aware that the Columbus GA lication of 2nd & Charles never closed.
http://www.2ndandcharles.com/locations/
"Want to get in touch with a 2nd & Charles near you? Find a store by clicking on your state and city, and contact via phone according to store hours..."
Oh will, you need not worry. I know how to fact check.
Go ahead, then... make your stalking useful for a change.
;)
Fact checking isn’t stalking, will. It’s just a way to keep liars and braggarts like you in check.
Remember?
Rocky
2020-05-30 00:01:45 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
And you found out I was correct, so all is good.
Post by ME
Post by ME
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
Wil......can’t you read?
I stated that I checked and second and Charles books Did Not Close.
I know.
I made a statement, you didn't believe me so you made phone calls and found out that I was correct, after all.
No reason to respond, glad to clear up your confusion and doubt.
;)
Ok, will, the one in Alabama shut down for a week. The one in Columbus, did not
I already know they were both open, I was not aware that the Books-A-Million closed for a week but I was aware that the Columbus GA lication of 2nd & Charles never closed.
http://www.2ndandcharles.com/locations/
"Want to get in touch with a 2nd & Charles near you? Find a store by clicking on your state and city, and contact via phone according to store hours..."
Oh will, you need not worry. I know how to fact check.
Go ahead, then... make your stalking useful for a change.
;)
Fact checking isn’t stalking
It is when you call in on folks like me trying to get them arrested, you lowbrow stalker troll.....
Rocky
2020-05-30 00:02:19 UTC
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Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
And you found out I was correct, so all is good.
Post by ME
Post by ME
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
Wil......can’t you read?
I stated that I checked and second and Charles books Did Not Close.
I know.
I made a statement, you didn't believe me so you made phone calls and found out that I was correct, after all.
No reason to respond, glad to clear up your confusion and doubt.
;)
Ok, will, the one in Alabama shut down for a week. The one in Columbus, did not
I already know they were both open, I was not aware that the Books-A-Million closed for a week but I was aware that the Columbus GA lication of 2nd & Charles never closed.
http://www.2ndandcharles.com/locations/
"Want to get in touch with a 2nd & Charles near you? Find a store by clicking on your state and city, and contact via phone according to store hours..."
Ha ha ha…

That should keep the smarmy little toad busy for a while,....!
Rocky
2020-06-01 23:38:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
And you found out I was correct, so all is good.
Post by ME
Post by ME
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
Wil......can’t you read?
I stated that I checked and second and Charles books Did Not Close.
I know.
I made a statement, you didn't believe me so you made phone calls and found out that I was correct, after all.
No reason to respond, glad to clear up your confusion and doubt.
;)
True that...
Rocky
2020-06-04 22:39:26 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
You are such a confused dullard, ME....

Ha ha ha...…….
ME
2020-06-04 23:00:10 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Rocky
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
You are such a confused dullard, ME....
Ha ha ha...…….
So you are also saying that there were non-essential businesses that were open during the shelter in place lockdown?
Rocky
2020-06-09 01:24:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by ME
Post by Rocky
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
You are such a confused dullard, ME....
Ha ha ha...…….
So you are also saying that there were non-essential businesses that were open during the shelter in place lockdown?
Apparently so....
Zod
2020-06-04 23:59:00 UTC
Reply
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Post by ME
Post by Rocky
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
You are such a confused dullard, ME....
Ha ha ha...…….
So you are also saying that there were non-essential businesses that were open during the shelter in place lockdown?
I suppose a bookstore was considered an essential business....
Zod
2020-06-05 01:50:00 UTC
Reply
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Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
And you found out I was correct, so all is good.
Post by ME
Post by ME
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
Wil......can’t you read?
I stated that I checked and second and Charles books Did Not Close.
I know.
I made a statement, you didn't believe me so you made phone calls and found out that I was correct, after all.
No reason to respond, glad to clear up your confusion and doubt.
;)
Ok, will, the one in Alabama shut down for a week. The one in Columbus, did not
I already know they were both open, I was not aware that the Books-A-Million closed for a week but I was aware that the Columbus GA lication of 2nd & Charles never closed.
http://www.2ndandcharles.com/locations/
"Want to get in touch with a 2nd & Charles near you? Find a store by clicking on your state and city, and contact via phone according to store hours..."
Oh will, you need not worry. I know how to fact check.
Go ahead, then... make your stalking useful for a change.
;)
Fact checking isn’t stalking xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Snooping around the persona information of others is, however....
Will.Dockery
2020-05-29 19:12:00 UTC
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Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
I wrote "local" because the Books-A-Million in nearby Opelika, Alabama also remained open during the crisis.
ME
2020-05-29 19:17:44 UTC
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Permalink
Post by Will.Dockery
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
I wrote "local" because the Books-A-Million in nearby Opelika, Alabama also remained open during the crisis.
No, it shut down for a week.
Will.Dockery
2020-05-29 19:15:00 UTC
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Permalink
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
There is no books a million in Columbus anymore.
I wrote local book stores... Books-A-Million is in nearby Opelika, Alabama.
ME
2020-05-29 19:21:45 UTC
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Permalink
Post by Will.Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
There is no books a million in Columbus anymore.
I wrote local book stores... Books-A-Million is in nearby Opelika, Alabama.
And books a million in opelika, al, was closed for a week.
Zod
2020-06-04 04:25:00 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by ME
Post by Will.Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
There is no books a million in Columbus anymore.
I wrote local book stores... Books-A-Million is in nearby Opelika, Alabama.
And books a million in opelika, al, was closed for a week.
And... your point is...?
Rocky
2020-05-31 01:28:37 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Will.Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
There is no books a million in Columbus anymore.
I wrote local book stores... Books-A-Million is in nearby Opelika, Alabama.
Not far at all....
Will.Dockery
2020-05-29 19:37:00 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by ME
Post by Will.Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
You wrote that the book stores never closed
That's right, the two book stores I named were open every day during the crisis.
I wrote about it here and elsewhere as it was happening.
There is no books a million in Columbus anymore.
I wrote local book stores... Books-A-Million is in nearby Opelika, Alabama.
And books a million in opelika, al, was closed for a week.
Okay, and Second & Charles here in Columbus, Georgia never closed, correct?
Will.Dockery
2020-05-29 19:42:00 UTC
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Post by ME
Post by Will.Dockery
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
I wrote "local" because the Books-A-Million in nearby Opelika, Alabama also remained open during the crisis.
No, it shut down for a week.
Okay, that was probably a week that I stayed at home.

The Columbus, Georgia book store Second And Charles is less than two miles from my house and I pass it every day so I know for a fact that it never closed during the crisis.

;)
Zod
2020-06-04 04:18:00 UTC
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Post by ME
Post by Will.Dockery
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
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Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
I wrote "local" because the Books-A-Million in nearby Opelika, Alabama also remained open during the crisis.
No, it shut down for a week.
Okay, that was probably a week that I stayed at home.
The Columbus, Georgia book store Second And Charles is less than two miles from my house and I pass it every day so I know for a fact that it never closed during the crisis.
;)
Obviously, why is ME so confused about this...?
Zod
2020-06-11 21:55:00 UTC
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Post by Will.Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will.Dockery
Post by ME
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by ME
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Lots of people are. I was isolating in January, and masking at the end of February, and i sure wasn't the only one.
I have little data, but it looks to me like there were two economic shutdowns - a voluntary one starting in early March, and the governors' shutdown at the end of the month. The voluntary one was smaller, of course, and spread out over a longer time - very much like the flattened curve in the infamous imperial College model - and it's not clear whether it could have accomplished enough social distancing to slow the spread without harming the economy as much as the mandated one did.
i do hope so, because (depending on the November election) closing private businesses could well end up as a part of the Democrats' policy tool kit. That's one reason court decisions like Wisconsin are so important.
Something to consider, it seems that businesses might have decided to stay open, "essential" or not, considering the local book stores Second & Charles and Books-A-Million never closed.
They shortened their hours and only allowed 7 people in the stores at a time, but these book stores never closed, not even for a day.
Will, Georgia was under a lockdown until late April. Are you saying that there were stores in Columbus that defied that order?
Read what I wrote, no reason to repeat it.
You wrote that the book stores never closed.
I checked and second and Charles did not close during the mandated closings of all non-essential businesses. And there’s no longer a books a million there. Second and Charles is the name they go by now.
I wrote "local" because the Books-A-Million in nearby Opelika, Alabama also remained open during the crisis.
No, it shut down for a week.
Okay, that was probably a week that I stayed at home.
The Columbus, Georgia book store Second And Charles is less than two miles from my house and I pass it every day so I know for a fact that it never closed during the crisis.
;)
And here we are, with ME in another state of utter confusion...

Some things never change....

Ha ha ha...
Zod
2020-06-03 20:36:00 UTC
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Nancy G. you are the main impostor here, since Nancy G. is not even your name.....
Zod
2020-06-10 05:45:00 UTC
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As I wrote earlier, Nancy G. you are the main impostor here, since Nancy G. is not even your name.....!
Zod
2020-06-03 20:39:00 UTC
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Nancy G. is probably the identity thieving fuck head....
Zod
2020-06-03 23:31:00 UTC
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Barry, you are a trolling idiot...
Art of (Art of Zod)
2020-05-28 20:07:00 UTC
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Post by Will Dockery
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Staying off xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Oh, look at the forging fool pretending to be a Conley.....

You are nothing but a forging fool, attempting to smear the name of the Conley family....
Zod
2020-05-28 20:37:00 UTC
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Post by Will Dockery
Places are opening up down here, even the music venues are slowly opening, but I am keeping the "stay at home" in place for now, personally.
Staying off xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Shut the fuck up you identity thieving scumbag liar......
George J. Dance
2020-06-15 01:14:02 UTC
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Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Fortunately, it seems that, a month later, enough people have been socially distancing voluntarily that there's been no second spike of infections in the state.
Zod
2020-06-15 01:22:00 UTC
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Post by George J. Dance
Post by General Zod
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Rocky
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
Interesting.... they seem to be tight up that way....
New cases are higher than in April, and they'll probably go higher still. OTOH, the state had 0 deaths yesterday, for the first time in two months.
Disturbing times....
Fortunately, a month later, there seem to have been enough people socially distancing voluntarily that infections and deaths have not spiked.
https://gdspoliticalanimal.blogspot.com/2020/06/voluntary-social-distancing-working-in.html
The same in Georgia.
Now if the violence on the streets will ease off, as well....
Zod
2020-06-21 14:50:40 UTC
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Post by George J. Dance
Post by philo
My wife and I went for a walk today and people were mostly keeping their distance but as the weather warms it looks like more or less normal interactions will return.
I think it's a shame that the Governor has been criticized because all he's doing is trying to save lives.
As I observe human nature I see that whether or not the Governor would have been able to legislate an extension to the isolation...people are going to just ignore it.
The good news is that the medical personnel are saving lives. Of course they are going to be over-worked and at risk
Fortunately, it seems that, a month later, enough people have been socially distancing voluntarily that there's been no second spike of infections in the state.
That is good.... and over all how goes it...?
Will Dockery
2020-06-27 19:50:49 UTC
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Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
Georgia isn't doing so good:

https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert

"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
George J. Dance
2020-06-29 16:44:03 UTC
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Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
On the same day, though, the state had 25 COVID-19 deaths. The surge in cases, that's happening in both Republican and Democratic states (though you wouldn't know about the latter by reading the news) is being paralleled with a continuous decline in deaths.

Sure, deaths lag new cases by about 23 days or so, so it's easy enough to worry about a coming death surge, but if that were to happen in Georgia, it should already have happened, since the state ended lockdown back on April 24. So what's going on?

I've been looking at the Georgia DPH COVID webpage, and I think there's a clue to the answer there, in the "Demographics" section. Of the 77,000 cases found to date in the state, the clear majority (41,570) are aged 18-49 - 3 demographic groups that have had only 2,858 hospitalizations and only 166 deaths (more than 100 of those 40-49, and just 13 aged 18-29).

I think we're seeing a major shift in social attitudes to the virus, based (as I think is normal and healthy) on putting self-interest first. When people in these age groups saw the virus as a mass killer, they isolated, at least as well as the older folk. However, now that they see it as potentially no worse than a coronavirus cold, more and more of them have started on the path to herd immunity.

If there's a surge in death cases, that could change, but I don't expect one. For one thing, hospitals haven't been "load-shedding" their long-term care patients into nursing homes like they were doing in March. For another, we now have at least one drug that works, and we've also learned about the dangers of ventilators.

TL/DR - yes, cases are surging, but that's not by itself a bad thing.
Zod
2020-06-30 00:16:17 UTC
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Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
On the same day, though, the state had 25 COVID-19 deaths. The surge in cases, that's happening in both Republican and Democratic states (though you wouldn't know about the latter by reading the news) is being paralleled with a continuous decline in deaths.
Sure, deaths lag new cases by about 23 days or so, so it's easy enough to worry about a coming death surge, but if that were to happen in Georgia, it should already have happened, since the state ended lockdown back on April 24. So what's going on?
I've been looking at the Georgia DPH COVID webpage, and I think there's a clue to the answer there, in the "Demographics" section. Of the 77,000 cases found to date in the state, the clear majority (41,570) are aged 18-49 - 3 demographic groups that have had only 2,858 hospitalizations and only 166 deaths (more than 100 of those 40-49, and just 13 aged 18-29).
I think we're seeing a major shift in social attitudes to the virus, based (as I think is normal and healthy) on putting self-interest first. When people in these age groups saw the virus as a mass killer, they isolated, at least as well as the older folk. However, now that they see it as potentially no worse than a coronavirus cold, more and more of them have started on the path to herd immunity.
If there's a surge in death cases, that could change, but I don't expect one. For one thing, hospitals haven't been "load-shedding" their long-term care patients into nursing homes like they were doing in March. For another, we now have at least one drug that works, and we've also learned about the dangers of ventilators.
TL/DR - yes, cases are surging, but that's not by itself a bad thing.
Yes, the death count is the bottom line, agreed....
Will Dockery
2020-07-01 05:05:25 UTC
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Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
On the same day, though, the state had 25 COVID-19 deaths. The surge in cases, that's happening in both Republican and Democratic states (though you wouldn't know about the latter by reading the news) is being paralleled with a continuous decline in deaths.
Sure, deaths lag new cases by about 23 days or so, so it's easy enough to worry about a coming death surge, but if that were to happen in Georgia, it should already have happened, since the state ended lockdown back on April 24. So what's going on?
I've been looking at the Georgia DPH COVID webpage, and I think there's a clue to the answer there, in the "Demographics" section. Of the 77,000 cases found to date in the state, the clear majority (41,570) are aged 18-49 - 3 demographic groups that have had only 2,858 hospitalizations and only 166 deaths (more than 100 of those 40-49, and just 13 aged 18-29).
I think we're seeing a major shift in social attitudes to the virus, based (as I think is normal and healthy) on putting self-interest first. When people in these age groups saw the virus as a mass killer, they isolated, at least as well as the older folk. However, now that they see it as potentially no worse than a coronavirus cold, more and more of them have started on the path to herd immunity.
If there's a surge in death cases, that could change, but I don't expect one. For one thing, hospitals haven't been "load-shedding" their long-term care patients into nursing homes like they were doing in March. For another, we now have at least one drug that works, and we've also learned about the dangers of ventilators.
TL/DR - yes, cases are surging, but that's not by itself a bad thing.
Sorry to see that our local library is completely shut down again:

================================================
Dear Customers,

All branches of the Chattahoochee Valley Libraries are temporarily suspending Curbside pickup of library materials beginning today June 30th, after learning that a staff member tested positive for COVID-19.

This decision was made out of an abundance of caution to reduce the risk of spreading the virus to the public and Library employees.

Staff members who had close contact with the employee are being asked to quarantine for 14 days as recommended by the CDC. We will be working closely with a professional cleaning service to perform intensive cleanings at all locations.

We have implemented new safety protocols including quarantining materials and increased cleaning to protect employees and prevent the spread of the virus. Masks and temperature and symptom checks have also been required, but the virus has unfortunately reached our workforce as cases in our area recently surged.

We will advise you about plans to resume curbside service soon.

For materials currently checked out, the Library advises:

* All book drops and 24-Hour locations remain closed.

* Items on hold will remain on hold until the Library reopens.

* All due dates for items currently checked out will be extended until the Library reopens.

We continue offering virtual programming, and a variety of digital materials including eBooks, eAudiobooks, movies, and music are available for checkout online.

Please visit the Library website and our Facebook Page for changes and the most up-to-date information about library services.

We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause. We look forward to serving you again soon.

Sincerely,
Chattahoochee Valley Libraries
======================================================
Will Dockery
2020-07-01 08:51:56 UTC
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Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
On the same day, though, the state had 25 COVID-19 deaths. The surge in cases, that's happening in both Republican and Democratic states (though you wouldn't know about the latter by reading the news) is being paralleled with a continuous decline in deaths.
Sure, deaths lag new cases by about 23 days or so, so it's easy enough to worry about a coming death surge, but if that were to happen in Georgia, it should already have happened, since the state ended lockdown back on April 24. So what's going on?
I've been looking at the Georgia DPH COVID webpage, and I think there's a clue to the answer there, in the "Demographics" section. Of the 77,000 cases found to date in the state, the clear majority (41,570) are aged 18-49 - 3 demographic groups that have had only 2,858 hospitalizations and only 166 deaths (more than 100 of those 40-49, and just 13 aged 18-29).
I think we're seeing a major shift in social attitudes to the virus, based (as I think is normal and healthy) on putting self-interest first. When people in these age groups saw the virus as a mass killer, they isolated, at least as well as the older folk. However, now that they see it as potentially no worse than a coronavirus cold, more and more of them have started on the path to herd immunity.
If there's a surge in death cases, that could change, but I don't expect one. For one thing, hospitals haven't been "load-shedding" their long-term care patients into nursing homes like they were doing in March. For another, we now have at least one drug that works, and we've also learned about the dangers of ventilators.
TL/DR - yes, cases are surging, but that's not by itself a bad thing.
Latest news from Columbus shows what I could call a surge in deaths:

https://www.wrbl.com/news/local-news/june-brings-a-sharp-rise-in-muscogee-county-covid-19-cases-deaths/?fbclid=IwAR0P79UPMYThgSbC9u5rP22ZR684JOSKRBROV0l0AnrPw4c_y50eaojJxGo

"On June 1, there were 632 cases and 18 COVID-related deaths in Muscogee County. June 29 — just four weeks later and two days before the month’s end — there were 1,536 cases and 43 deaths..."
George J. Dance
2020-07-01 16:02:09 UTC
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Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
On the same day, though, the state had 25 COVID-19 deaths. The surge in cases, that's happening in both Republican and Democratic states (though you wouldn't know about the latter by reading the news) is being paralleled with a continuous decline in deaths.
Sure, deaths lag new cases by about 23 days or so, so it's easy enough to worry about a coming death surge, but if that were to happen in Georgia, it should already have happened, since the state ended lockdown back on April 24. So what's going on?
I've been looking at the Georgia DPH COVID webpage, and I think there's a clue to the answer there, in the "Demographics" section. Of the 77,000 cases found to date in the state, the clear majority (41,570) are aged 18-49 - 3 demographic groups that have had only 2,858 hospitalizations and only 166 deaths (more than 100 of those 40-49, and just 13 aged 18-29).
I think we're seeing a major shift in social attitudes to the virus, based (as I think is normal and healthy) on putting self-interest first. When people in these age groups saw the virus as a mass killer, they isolated, at least as well as the older folk. However, now that they see it as potentially no worse than a coronavirus cold, more and more of them have started on the path to herd immunity.
If there's a surge in death cases, that could change, but I don't expect one. For one thing, hospitals haven't been "load-shedding" their long-term care patients into nursing homes like they were doing in March. For another, we now have at least one drug that works, and we've also learned about the dangers of ventilators.
TL/DR - yes, cases are surging, but that's not by itself a bad thing.
https://www.wrbl.com/news/local-news/june-brings-a-sharp-rise-in-muscogee-county-covid-19-cases-deaths/?fbclid=IwAR0P79UPMYThgSbC9u5rP22ZR684JOSKRBROV0l0AnrPw4c_y50eaojJxGo
"On June 1, there were 632 cases and 18 COVID-related deaths in Muscogee County. June 29 — just four weeks later and two days before the month’s end — there were 1,536 cases and 43 deaths..."
Oh, yeah, that's what it looks like, doesn't it? That's an easy way to make it look like that - compare two points on the death curve. In fact, if you look at the reported deaths -

https://www.google.ca/search?sxsrf=ALeKk02ntIlqt79rKtGWLFk41Wbb_Wdc1g%3A1593616645420&source=hp&ei=Ban8XtrwFoq-tAazjLmQCQ&q=coronavirus+deaths+georgia&oq=coronavirus+deaths+&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAxgAMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIABBDMgoIABCxAxCxAxBDMgQIABBDMgUIABCxAzIICAAQsQMQsQMyBQgAELEDMgUIABCxAzoHCCMQ6gIQJzoHCC4Q6gIQJzoHCAAQsQMQQzoFCAAQkQI6CggAELEDEEMQiwM6DgguELEDEMcBEKMCEIsDOgcIABBDEIsDOg0IABCxAxAUEIcCEIsDOg0IABCxAxCxAxBDEIsDOggIABCxAxCLAzoECAAQCjoNCAAQsQMQsQMQFBCHAlC9I1jMR2CLZGgCcAB4AIAB3AGIAa8SkgEGNy4xMi4xmAEAoAEBqgEHZ3dzLXdperABCrgBAg&sclient=psy-ab

The first thing that pops up is that there's no curve: the graph goes up and down wildly. In order to get a curve, the usual trick is to take a 5-day or 7 -day average. Let's do a 5-day average for both dates: add the 2 days before, plus the 2 following, and divide by 5. (I have to use state figures, as google doesn't give the historical figures for county. And the July 1 figures aren't out yet, so I'll have to go back one more day for that set):

May 30 - 20
31 - 49
June 1 - 36
2 - 13
2 - 21
------
139

28 deaths

June 26 - 25
27 - 6
28 - 2
29 - 6
30 - 21
--------
60

12 deaths

Remember, the caseload and death counts are supposed to be doubling every 5 days (with the lowest estimated Reproduction number of 2). Instead, deaths have halved in a month.

Just for fun, let's compare those with the last 5 days of lockdown in the state:

Apr. 19 - 12
20 - 86
21 - 43
22 - 28
23 - 35

---------
204

41 deaths

That doesn't prove that ending the lockdown saved lives, of course; but it's more than enough to prove that the lockdown was not saving lives - that whatever was reducing deaths in April, during the lockdown, was still reducing them in May and June, after it was over.
k***@gmail.com
2020-07-01 16:35:32 UTC
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Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
On the same day, though, the state had 25 COVID-19 deaths. The surge in cases, that's happening in both Republican and Democratic states (though you wouldn't know about the latter by reading the news) is being paralleled with a continuous decline in deaths.
Sure, deaths lag new cases by about 23 days or so, so it's easy enough to worry about a coming death surge, but if that were to happen in Georgia, it should already have happened, since the state ended lockdown back on April 24. So what's going on?
I've been looking at the Georgia DPH COVID webpage, and I think there's a clue to the answer there, in the "Demographics" section. Of the 77,000 cases found to date in the state, the clear majority (41,570) are aged 18-49 - 3 demographic groups that have had only 2,858 hospitalizations and only 166 deaths (more than 100 of those 40-49, and just 13 aged 18-29).
I think we're seeing a major shift in social attitudes to the virus, based (as I think is normal and healthy) on putting self-interest first. When people in these age groups saw the virus as a mass killer, they isolated, at least as well as the older folk. However, now that they see it as potentially no worse than a coronavirus cold, more and more of them have started on the path to herd immunity.
If there's a surge in death cases, that could change, but I don't expect one. For one thing, hospitals haven't been "load-shedding" their long-term care patients into nursing homes like they were doing in March. For another, we now have at least one drug that works, and we've also learned about the dangers of ventilators.
TL/DR - yes, cases are surging, but that's not by itself a bad thing.
https://www.wrbl.com/news/local-news/june-brings-a-sharp-rise-in-muscogee-county-covid-19-cases-deaths/?fbclid=IwAR0P79UPMYThgSbC9u5rP22ZR684JOSKRBROV0l0AnrPw4c_y50eaojJxGo
"On June 1, there were 632 cases and 18 COVID-related deaths in Muscogee County. June 29 — just four weeks later and two days before the month’s end — there were 1,536 cases and 43 deaths..."
Oh, yeah, that's what it looks like, doesn't it? That's an easy way to make it look like that - compare two points on the death curve. In fact, if you look at the reported deaths -
https://www.google.ca/search?sxsrf=ALeKk02ntIlqt79rKtGWLFk41Wbb_Wdc1g%3A1593616645420&source=hp&ei=Ban8XtrwFoq-tAazjLmQCQ&q=coronavirus+deaths+georgia&oq=coronavirus+deaths+&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAxgAMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIABBDMgoIABCxAxCxAxBDMgQIABBDMgUIABCxAzIICAAQsQMQsQMyBQgAELEDMgUIABCxAzoHCCMQ6gIQJzoHCC4Q6gIQJzoHCAAQsQMQQzoFCAAQkQI6CggAELEDEEMQiwM6DgguELEDEMcBEKMCEIsDOgcIABBDEIsDOg0IABCxAxAUEIcCEIsDOg0IABCxAxCxAxBDEIsDOggIABCxAxCLAzoECAAQCjoNCAAQsQMQsQMQFBCHAlC9I1jMR2CLZGgCcAB4AIAB3AGIAa8SkgEGNy4xMi4xmAEAoAEBqgEHZ3dzLXdperABCrgBAg&sclient=psy-ab
May 30 - 20
31 - 49
June 1 - 36
2 - 13
2 - 21
------
139
28 deaths
June 26 - 25
27 - 6
28 - 2
29 - 6
30 - 21
--------
60
12 deaths
Remember, the caseload and death counts are supposed to be doubling every 5 days (with the lowest estimated Reproduction number of 2). Instead, deaths have halved in a month.
Apr. 19 - 12
20 - 86
21 - 43
22 - 28
23 - 35
---------
204
41 deaths
That doesn't prove that ending the lockdown saved lives, of course; but it's more than enough to prove that the lockdown was not saving lives - that whatever was reducing deaths in April, during the lockdown, was still reducing them in May and June, after it was over.
I strongly suggest you look at the numbers for NY and NJ. We've gotten Covid 19 infections down to manageable rates by using masks and social distancing. The masks help wearer from infecting other people if they have the virus. The protection to the wearer is not as great as the protection of others. A lot of people died. Because of the high population of these states, the curves are pretty obvious.

Unfortunately, a large portion of the rest of the US will be going through what NJ & NY went though in April and May. NJ is requesting that people coming to NJ from highly infected states self-quarantine to prevent infecting us again.

Protect yourselves. Stay 6ft apart and wear masks and gloves if you have to go out.
NancyGene
2020-07-01 16:59:19 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by k***@gmail.com
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
On the same day, though, the state had 25 COVID-19 deaths. The surge in cases, that's happening in both Republican and Democratic states (though you wouldn't know about the latter by reading the news) is being paralleled with a continuous decline in deaths.
Sure, deaths lag new cases by about 23 days or so, so it's easy enough to worry about a coming death surge, but if that were to happen in Georgia, it should already have happened, since the state ended lockdown back on April 24. So what's going on?
I've been looking at the Georgia DPH COVID webpage, and I think there's a clue to the answer there, in the "Demographics" section. Of the 77,000 cases found to date in the state, the clear majority (41,570) are aged 18-49 - 3 demographic groups that have had only 2,858 hospitalizations and only 166 deaths (more than 100 of those 40-49, and just 13 aged 18-29).
I think we're seeing a major shift in social attitudes to the virus, based (as I think is normal and healthy) on putting self-interest first. When people in these age groups saw the virus as a mass killer, they isolated, at least as well as the older folk. However, now that they see it as potentially no worse than a coronavirus cold, more and more of them have started on the path to herd immunity.
If there's a surge in death cases, that could change, but I don't expect one. For one thing, hospitals haven't been "load-shedding" their long-term care patients into nursing homes like they were doing in March. For another, we now have at least one drug that works, and we've also learned about the dangers of ventilators.
TL/DR - yes, cases are surging, but that's not by itself a bad thing.
https://www.wrbl.com/news/local-news/june-brings-a-sharp-rise-in-muscogee-county-covid-19-cases-deaths/?fbclid=IwAR0P79UPMYThgSbC9u5rP22ZR684JOSKRBROV0l0AnrPw4c_y50eaojJxGo
"On June 1, there were 632 cases and 18 COVID-related deaths in Muscogee County. June 29 — just four weeks later and two days before the month’s end — there were 1,536 cases and 43 deaths..."
Oh, yeah, that's what it looks like, doesn't it? That's an easy way to make it look like that - compare two points on the death curve. In fact, if you look at the reported deaths -
https://www.google.ca/search?sxsrf=ALeKk02ntIlqt79rKtGWLFk41Wbb_Wdc1g%3A1593616645420&source=hp&ei=Ban8XtrwFoq-tAazjLmQCQ&q=coronavirus+deaths+georgia&oq=coronavirus+deaths+&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAxgAMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIABBDMgoIABCxAxCxAxBDMgQIABBDMgUIABCxAzIICAAQsQMQsQMyBQgAELEDMgUIABCxAzoHCCMQ6gIQJzoHCC4Q6gIQJzoHCAAQsQMQQzoFCAAQkQI6CggAELEDEEMQiwM6DgguELEDEMcBEKMCEIsDOgcIABBDEIsDOg0IABCxAxAUEIcCEIsDOg0IABCxAxCxAxBDEIsDOggIABCxAxCLAzoECAAQCjoNCAAQsQMQsQMQFBCHAlC9I1jMR2CLZGgCcAB4AIAB3AGIAa8SkgEGNy4xMi4xmAEAoAEBqgEHZ3dzLXdperABCrgBAg&sclient=psy-ab
May 30 - 20
31 - 49
June 1 - 36
2 - 13
2 - 21
------
139
28 deaths
June 26 - 25
27 - 6
28 - 2
29 - 6
30 - 21
--------
60
12 deaths
Remember, the caseload and death counts are supposed to be doubling every 5 days (with the lowest estimated Reproduction number of 2). Instead, deaths have halved in a month.
Apr. 19 - 12
20 - 86
21 - 43
22 - 28
23 - 35
---------
204
41 deaths
That doesn't prove that ending the lockdown saved lives, of course; but it's more than enough to prove that the lockdown was not saving lives - that whatever was reducing deaths in April, during the lockdown, was still reducing them in May and June, after it was over.
I strongly suggest you look at the numbers for NY and NJ. We've gotten Covid 19 infections down to manageable rates by using masks and social distancing. The masks help wearer from infecting other people if they have the virus. The protection to the wearer is not as great as the protection of others. A lot of people died. Because of the high population of these states, the curves are pretty obvious.
Unfortunately, a large portion of the rest of the US will be going through what NJ & NY went though in April and May. NJ is requesting that people coming to NJ from highly infected states self-quarantine to prevent infecting us again.
Protect yourselves. Stay 6ft apart and wear masks and gloves if you have to go out.
We have seen too many people wearing masks in such a way that they don't cover their nose. That's not helpful.
George J. Dance
2020-07-01 17:21:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by k***@gmail.com
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
On the same day, though, the state had 25 COVID-19 deaths. The surge in cases, that's happening in both Republican and Democratic states (though you wouldn't know about the latter by reading the news) is being paralleled with a continuous decline in deaths.
Sure, deaths lag new cases by about 23 days or so, so it's easy enough to worry about a coming death surge, but if that were to happen in Georgia, it should already have happened, since the state ended lockdown back on April 24. So what's going on?
I've been looking at the Georgia DPH COVID webpage, and I think there's a clue to the answer there, in the "Demographics" section. Of the 77,000 cases found to date in the state, the clear majority (41,570) are aged 18-49 - 3 demographic groups that have had only 2,858 hospitalizations and only 166 deaths (more than 100 of those 40-49, and just 13 aged 18-29).
I think we're seeing a major shift in social attitudes to the virus, based (as I think is normal and healthy) on putting self-interest first. When people in these age groups saw the virus as a mass killer, they isolated, at least as well as the older folk. However, now that they see it as potentially no worse than a coronavirus cold, more and more of them have started on the path to herd immunity.
If there's a surge in death cases, that could change, but I don't expect one. For one thing, hospitals haven't been "load-shedding" their long-term care patients into nursing homes like they were doing in March. For another, we now have at least one drug that works, and we've also learned about the dangers of ventilators.
TL/DR - yes, cases are surging, but that's not by itself a bad thing.
https://www.wrbl.com/news/local-news/june-brings-a-sharp-rise-in-muscogee-county-covid-19-cases-deaths/?fbclid=IwAR0P79UPMYThgSbC9u5rP22ZR684JOSKRBROV0l0AnrPw4c_y50eaojJxGo
"On June 1, there were 632 cases and 18 COVID-related deaths in Muscogee County. June 29 — just four weeks later and two days before the month’s end — there were 1,536 cases and 43 deaths..."
Oh, yeah, that's what it looks like, doesn't it? That's an easy way to make it look like that - compare two points on the death curve. In fact, if you look at the reported deaths -
https://www.google.ca/search?sxsrf=ALeKk02ntIlqt79rKtGWLFk41Wbb_Wdc1g%3A1593616645420&source=hp&ei=Ban8XtrwFoq-tAazjLmQCQ&q=coronavirus+deaths+georgia&oq=coronavirus+deaths+&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAxgAMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIABBDMgoIABCxAxCxAxBDMgQIABBDMgUIABCxAzIICAAQsQMQsQMyBQgAELEDMgUIABCxAzoHCCMQ6gIQJzoHCC4Q6gIQJzoHCAAQsQMQQzoFCAAQkQI6CggAELEDEEMQiwM6DgguELEDEMcBEKMCEIsDOgcIABBDEIsDOg0IABCxAxAUEIcCEIsDOg0IABCxAxCxAxBDEIsDOggIABCxAxCLAzoECAAQCjoNCAAQsQMQsQMQFBCHAlC9I1jMR2CLZGgCcAB4AIAB3AGIAa8SkgEGNy4xMi4xmAEAoAEBqgEHZ3dzLXdperABCrgBAg&sclient=psy-ab
May 30 - 20
31 - 49
June 1 - 36
2 - 13
2 - 21
------
139
28 deaths
June 26 - 25
27 - 6
28 - 2
29 - 6
30 - 21
--------
60
12 deaths
Remember, the caseload and death counts are supposed to be doubling every 5 days (with the lowest estimated Reproduction number of 2). Instead, deaths have halved in a month.
Apr. 19 - 12
20 - 86
21 - 43
22 - 28
23 - 35
---------
204
41 deaths
That doesn't prove that ending the lockdown saved lives, of course; but it's more than enough to prove that the lockdown was not saving lives - that whatever was reducing deaths in April, during the lockdown, was still reducing them in May and June, after it was over.
I strongly suggest you look at the numbers for NY and NJ. We've gotten Covid 19 infections down to manageable rates by using masks and social distancing.
That's probably what did cause the decline: mask wearing, physical distancing, and disinfecting. Not stay-at-home orders (which may have increased deaths in the short term), and not business closings (which probably helped reinforce stay-at-home orders, to an unknown degree, but at a huge also unknown cost). Voluntary changes in behavior in response to a perceived threat.

People changed their behavior in response to perceived risk. Remember, before March the authorities were downplaying the risk - your mayor was taking TV camera crews on subway rides, just to pontificate about show how safe it all was. But, thanks to the media showing pictures of Italy 24/7, people had already begun voluntarily distancing on their own.

The masks help wearer from infecting other people if they have the virus. The protection to the wearer is not as great as the protection of others.

As I've said I've been wearing a mask since February; back when you wear telling me categorically that a mask would not protect me - and even the 'experts' at Public Heath Toronto was telling me not to wear one. Today - four months after the pandemic started here - our mayor made mask wearing mandatory. Am I supposed to now give him the credit? As I see it, he's simply adding insult to injury.
Post by k***@gmail.com
A lot of people died. Because of the high population of these states, the curves are pretty obvious.
Sure, the figures were grim, in Greater New York (gny). The disease followed the same trajectory as everywhere else, but the absolute numbers were so high. high as in Wuhan. Why?

My hypothesis is that it's due to the large Italian community in gny, probably the richest part of the Italian diaspora - millions of Italians have family there, and vice versa.

When a pandemic hits, the rational thing to do is to leave the area entirely as soon as one can. During early March, tens of thousands, Italians left the country, and the logical place for them to go would be ny. If just 10% were infected but pre-symptomatic, that would be hundreds and thousands of patient zeroes starting hundreds and thousands of mini-outbreaks throughout gny, all of them spreading exponentially at first.
Post by k***@gmail.com
Unfortunately, a large portion of the rest of the US will be going through what NJ & NY went though in April and May. NJ is requesting that people coming to NJ from highly infected states self-quarantine to prevent infecting us again.
Well, that's what I have my eye on: hospitalizations and deaths. So far the surge isn't happening.
Post by k***@gmail.com
Protect yourselves. Stay 6ft apart and wear masks and gloves if you have to go out.
Agreed: voluntary social distancing needs to continue. I say that as a more vulnerable person (a senior and a smoker), and also for political reasons:
I'd like the evidence to show that voluntary social distancing is as effective as government lockdown.

In terms of keeping hospitalizations and deaths down, it's most important that we seniors continue to socially distance - and fortunately there's a government dole that allows them to give up their jobs.
k***@gmail.com
2020-07-01 18:20:37 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by George J. Dance
Post by k***@gmail.com
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
On the same day, though, the state had 25 COVID-19 deaths. The surge in cases, that's happening in both Republican and Democratic states (though you wouldn't know about the latter by reading the news) is being paralleled with a continuous decline in deaths.
Sure, deaths lag new cases by about 23 days or so, so it's easy enough to worry about a coming death surge, but if that were to happen in Georgia, it should already have happened, since the state ended lockdown back on April 24. So what's going on?
I've been looking at the Georgia DPH COVID webpage, and I think there's a clue to the answer there, in the "Demographics" section. Of the 77,000 cases found to date in the state, the clear majority (41,570) are aged 18-49 - 3 demographic groups that have had only 2,858 hospitalizations and only 166 deaths (more than 100 of those 40-49, and just 13 aged 18-29).
I think we're seeing a major shift in social attitudes to the virus, based (as I think is normal and healthy) on putting self-interest first. When people in these age groups saw the virus as a mass killer, they isolated, at least as well as the older folk. However, now that they see it as potentially no worse than a coronavirus cold, more and more of them have started on the path to herd immunity.
If there's a surge in death cases, that could change, but I don't expect one. For one thing, hospitals haven't been "load-shedding" their long-term care patients into nursing homes like they were doing in March. For another, we now have at least one drug that works, and we've also learned about the dangers of ventilators.
TL/DR - yes, cases are surging, but that's not by itself a bad thing.
https://www.wrbl.com/news/local-news/june-brings-a-sharp-rise-in-muscogee-county-covid-19-cases-deaths/?fbclid=IwAR0P79UPMYThgSbC9u5rP22ZR684JOSKRBROV0l0AnrPw4c_y50eaojJxGo
"On June 1, there were 632 cases and 18 COVID-related deaths in Muscogee County. June 29 — just four weeks later and two days before the month’s end — there were 1,536 cases and 43 deaths..."
Oh, yeah, that's what it looks like, doesn't it? That's an easy way to make it look like that - compare two points on the death curve. In fact, if you look at the reported deaths -
https://www.google.ca/search?sxsrf=ALeKk02ntIlqt79rKtGWLFk41Wbb_Wdc1g%3A1593616645420&source=hp&ei=Ban8XtrwFoq-tAazjLmQCQ&q=coronavirus+deaths+georgia&oq=coronavirus+deaths+&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAxgAMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIABBDMgoIABCxAxCxAxBDMgQIABBDMgUIABCxAzIICAAQsQMQsQMyBQgAELEDMgUIABCxAzoHCCMQ6gIQJzoHCC4Q6gIQJzoHCAAQsQMQQzoFCAAQkQI6CggAELEDEEMQiwM6DgguELEDEMcBEKMCEIsDOgcIABBDEIsDOg0IABCxAxAUEIcCEIsDOg0IABCxAxCxAxBDEIsDOggIABCxAxCLAzoECAAQCjoNCAAQsQMQsQMQFBCHAlC9I1jMR2CLZGgCcAB4AIAB3AGIAa8SkgEGNy4xMi4xmAEAoAEBqgEHZ3dzLXdperABCrgBAg&sclient=psy-ab
May 30 - 20
31 - 49
June 1 - 36
2 - 13
2 - 21
------
139
28 deaths
June 26 - 25
27 - 6
28 - 2
29 - 6
30 - 21
--------
60
12 deaths
Remember, the caseload and death counts are supposed to be doubling every 5 days (with the lowest estimated Reproduction number of 2). Instead, deaths have halved in a month.
Apr. 19 - 12
20 - 86
21 - 43
22 - 28
23 - 35
---------
204
41 deaths
That doesn't prove that ending the lockdown saved lives, of course; but it's more than enough to prove that the lockdown was not saving lives - that whatever was reducing deaths in April, during the lockdown, was still reducing them in May and June, after it was over.
I strongly suggest you look at the numbers for NY and NJ. We've gotten Covid 19 infections down to manageable rates by using masks and social distancing.
That's probably what did cause the decline: mask wearing, physical distancing, and disinfecting. Not stay-at-home orders (which may have increased deaths in the short term), and not business closings (which probably helped reinforce stay-at-home orders, to an unknown degree, but at a huge also unknown cost). Voluntary changes in behavior in response to a perceived threat.
People changed their behavior in response to perceived risk. Remember, before March the authorities were downplaying the risk - your mayor was taking TV camera crews on subway rides, just to pontificate about show how safe it all was. But, thanks to the media showing pictures of Italy 24/7, people had already begun voluntarily distancing on their own.
The masks help wearer from infecting other people if they have the virus. The protection to the wearer is not as great as the protection of others.
As I've said I've been wearing a mask since February; back when you wear telling me categorically that a mask would not protect me - and even the 'experts' at Public Heath Toronto was telling me not to wear one. Today - four months after the pandemic started here - our mayor made mask wearing mandatory. Am I supposed to now give him the credit? As I see it, he's simply adding insult to injury.
Post by k***@gmail.com
A lot of people died. Because of the high population of these states, the curves are pretty obvious.
Sure, the figures were grim, in Greater New York (gny). The disease followed the same trajectory as everywhere else, but the absolute numbers were so high. high as in Wuhan. Why?
My hypothesis is that it's due to the large Italian community in gny, probably the richest part of the Italian diaspora - millions of Italians have family there, and vice versa.
When a pandemic hits, the rational thing to do is to leave the area entirely as soon as one can. During early March, tens of thousands, Italians left the country, and the logical place for them to go would be ny. If just 10% were infected but pre-symptomatic, that would be hundreds and thousands of patient zeroes starting hundreds and thousands of mini-outbreaks throughout gny, all of them spreading exponentially at first.
Post by k***@gmail.com
Unfortunately, a large portion of the rest of the US will be going through what NJ & NY went though in April and May. NJ is requesting that people coming to NJ from highly infected states self-quarantine to prevent infecting us again.
Well, that's what I have my eye on: hospitalizations and deaths. So far the surge isn't happening.
Post by k***@gmail.com
Protect yourselves. Stay 6ft apart and wear masks and gloves if you have to go out.
I'd like the evidence to show that voluntary social distancing is as effective as government lockdown.
In terms of keeping hospitalizations and deaths down, it's most important that we seniors continue to socially distance - and fortunately there's a government dole that allows them to give up their jobs.
I'm working full time in the lab now. I wear a mask except when I'm in my cube. Everyone must wear a mask, social distance and wash their hands or use sanitizer frequently. Most stores are open but shoppers must wear masks and observe 6ft distance when possible. Restaurants may only serve at outdoor tables spaced far apart, indoor dining has is still banned. This is partly because large groups of young people were observed at seaside bars close to each other and without masks. I will not eat at a restaurant, inside or outside, until I've gotten a vaccine, but we are ordering take-out occasionally to keep favorite restaurants in business until this is over. This is really damaging taverns and bars. Many NJ restaurants were already BYOB, in general they are staying in business with take-out.
George J. Dance
2020-07-01 18:50:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by k***@gmail.com
Post by George J. Dance
Post by k***@gmail.com
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
On the same day, though, the state had 25 COVID-19 deaths. The surge in cases, that's happening in both Republican and Democratic states (though you wouldn't know about the latter by reading the news) is being paralleled with a continuous decline in deaths.
Sure, deaths lag new cases by about 23 days or so, so it's easy enough to worry about a coming death surge, but if that were to happen in Georgia, it should already have happened, since the state ended lockdown back on April 24. So what's going on?
I've been looking at the Georgia DPH COVID webpage, and I think there's a clue to the answer there, in the "Demographics" section. Of the 77,000 cases found to date in the state, the clear majority (41,570) are aged 18-49 - 3 demographic groups that have had only 2,858 hospitalizations and only 166 deaths (more than 100 of those 40-49, and just 13 aged 18-29).
I think we're seeing a major shift in social attitudes to the virus, based (as I think is normal and healthy) on putting self-interest first. When people in these age groups saw the virus as a mass killer, they isolated, at least as well as the older folk. However, now that they see it as potentially no worse than a coronavirus cold, more and more of them have started on the path to herd immunity.
If there's a surge in death cases, that could change, but I don't expect one. For one thing, hospitals haven't been "load-shedding" their long-term care patients into nursing homes like they were doing in March. For another, we now have at least one drug that works, and we've also learned about the dangers of ventilators.
TL/DR - yes, cases are surging, but that's not by itself a bad thing.
https://www.wrbl.com/news/local-news/june-brings-a-sharp-rise-in-muscogee-county-covid-19-cases-deaths/?fbclid=IwAR0P79UPMYThgSbC9u5rP22ZR684JOSKRBROV0l0AnrPw4c_y50eaojJxGo
"On June 1, there were 632 cases and 18 COVID-related deaths in Muscogee County. June 29 — just four weeks later and two days before the month’s end — there were 1,536 cases and 43 deaths..."
Oh, yeah, that's what it looks like, doesn't it? That's an easy way to make it look like that - compare two points on the death curve. In fact, if you look at the reported deaths -
https://www.google.ca/search?sxsrf=ALeKk02ntIlqt79rKtGWLFk41Wbb_Wdc1g%3A1593616645420&source=hp&ei=Ban8XtrwFoq-tAazjLmQCQ&q=coronavirus+deaths+georgia&oq=coronavirus+deaths+&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAxgAMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIABBDMgoIABCxAxCxAxBDMgQIABBDMgUIABCxAzIICAAQsQMQsQMyBQgAELEDMgUIABCxAzoHCCMQ6gIQJzoHCC4Q6gIQJzoHCAAQsQMQQzoFCAAQkQI6CggAELEDEEMQiwM6DgguELEDEMcBEKMCEIsDOgcIABBDEIsDOg0IABCxAxAUEIcCEIsDOg0IABCxAxCxAxBDEIsDOggIABCxAxCLAzoECAAQCjoNCAAQsQMQsQMQFBCHAlC9I1jMR2CLZGgCcAB4AIAB3AGIAa8SkgEGNy4xMi4xmAEAoAEBqgEHZ3dzLXdperABCrgBAg&sclient=psy-ab
May 30 - 20
31 - 49
June 1 - 36
2 - 13
2 - 21
------
139
28 deaths
June 26 - 25
27 - 6
28 - 2
29 - 6
30 - 21
--------
60
12 deaths
Remember, the caseload and death counts are supposed to be doubling every 5 days (with the lowest estimated Reproduction number of 2). Instead, deaths have halved in a month.
Apr. 19 - 12
20 - 86
21 - 43
22 - 28
23 - 35
---------
204
41 deaths
That doesn't prove that ending the lockdown saved lives, of course; but it's more than enough to prove that the lockdown was not saving lives - that whatever was reducing deaths in April, during the lockdown, was still reducing them in May and June, after it was over.
I strongly suggest you look at the numbers for NY and NJ. We've gotten Covid 19 infections down to manageable rates by using masks and social distancing.
That's probably what did cause the decline: mask wearing, physical distancing, and disinfecting. Not stay-at-home orders (which may have increased deaths in the short term), and not business closings (which probably helped reinforce stay-at-home orders, to an unknown degree, but at a huge also unknown cost). Voluntary changes in behavior in response to a perceived threat.
People changed their behavior in response to perceived risk. Remember, before March the authorities were downplaying the risk - your mayor was taking TV camera crews on subway rides, just to pontificate about show how safe it all was. But, thanks to the media showing pictures of Italy 24/7, people had already begun voluntarily distancing on their own.
The masks help wearer from infecting other people if they have the virus. The protection to the wearer is not as great as the protection of others.
As I've said I've been wearing a mask since February; back when you wear telling me categorically that a mask would not protect me - and even the 'experts' at Public Heath Toronto was telling me not to wear one. Today - four months after the pandemic started here - our mayor made mask wearing mandatory. Am I supposed to now give him the credit? As I see it, he's simply adding insult to injury.
Post by k***@gmail.com
A lot of people died. Because of the high population of these states, the curves are pretty obvious.
Sure, the figures were grim, in Greater New York (gny). The disease followed the same trajectory as everywhere else, but the absolute numbers were so high. high as in Wuhan. Why?
My hypothesis is that it's due to the large Italian community in gny, probably the richest part of the Italian diaspora - millions of Italians have family there, and vice versa.
When a pandemic hits, the rational thing to do is to leave the area entirely as soon as one can. During early March, tens of thousands, Italians left the country, and the logical place for them to go would be ny. If just 10% were infected but pre-symptomatic, that would be hundreds and thousands of patient zeroes starting hundreds and thousands of mini-outbreaks throughout gny, all of them spreading exponentially at first.
Post by k***@gmail.com
Unfortunately, a large portion of the rest of the US will be going through what NJ & NY went though in April and May. NJ is requesting that people coming to NJ from highly infected states self-quarantine to prevent infecting us again.
Well, that's what I have my eye on: hospitalizations and deaths. So far the surge isn't happening.
Post by k***@gmail.com
Protect yourselves. Stay 6ft apart and wear masks and gloves if you have to go out.
I'd like the evidence to show that voluntary social distancing is as effective as government lockdown.
In terms of keeping hospitalizations and deaths down, it's most important that we seniors continue to socially distance - and fortunately there's a government dole that allows them to give up their jobs.
I'm working full time in the lab now. I wear a mask except when I'm in my cube. Everyone must wear a mask, social distance and wash their hands or use sanitizer frequently. Most stores are open but shoppers must wear masks and observe 6ft distance when possible. Restaurants may only serve at outdoor tables spaced far apart, indoor dining has is still banned. This is partly because large groups of young people were observed at seaside bars close to each other and without masks. I will not eat at a restaurant, inside or outside, until I've gotten a vaccine, but we are ordering take-out occasionally to keep favorite restaurants in business until this is over. This is really damaging taverns and bars.
The next generation took me out last week for a belated Father's Day meal. It's the same rules here: patio dining only, directional arrows leading in and out, and everyone wore a mask. The 6 or so tables were full by the time we left, so I hope the company is doing OK. Lots of businesses are going under.
Post by k***@gmail.com
Many NJ restaurants were already BYOB, in general they are staying in business with take-out.
It's so easy for a libertarian like me, fulminating about the lockdown, to forget that the crisis has made us freer in some ways, at least for the emergency period. The defacto repeal of the laws stopping restaurants from delivering alcohol was a giant step in your country's Long March away from Prohibition.
Will Dockery
2020-07-02 13:24:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by George J. Dance
Post by k***@gmail.com
Post by George J. Dance
Post by k***@gmail.com
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
On the same day, though, the state had 25 COVID-19 deaths. The surge in cases, that's happening in both Republican and Democratic states (though you wouldn't know about the latter by reading the news) is being paralleled with a continuous decline in deaths.
Sure, deaths lag new cases by about 23 days or so, so it's easy enough to worry about a coming death surge, but if that were to happen in Georgia, it should already have happened, since the state ended lockdown back on April 24. So what's going on?
I've been looking at the Georgia DPH COVID webpage, and I think there's a clue to the answer there, in the "Demographics" section. Of the 77,000 cases found to date in the state, the clear majority (41,570) are aged 18-49 - 3 demographic groups that have had only 2,858 hospitalizations and only 166 deaths (more than 100 of those 40-49, and just 13 aged 18-29).
I think we're seeing a major shift in social attitudes to the virus, based (as I think is normal and healthy) on putting self-interest first. When people in these age groups saw the virus as a mass killer, they isolated, at least as well as the older folk. However, now that they see it as potentially no worse than a coronavirus cold, more and more of them have started on the path to herd immunity.
If there's a surge in death cases, that could change, but I don't expect one. For one thing, hospitals haven't been "load-shedding" their long-term care patients into nursing homes like they were doing in March. For another, we now have at least one drug that works, and we've also learned about the dangers of ventilators.
TL/DR - yes, cases are surging, but that's not by itself a bad thing.
https://www.wrbl.com/news/local-news/june-brings-a-sharp-rise-in-muscogee-county-covid-19-cases-deaths/?fbclid=IwAR0P79UPMYThgSbC9u5rP22ZR684JOSKRBROV0l0AnrPw4c_y50eaojJxGo
"On June 1, there were 632 cases and 18 COVID-related deaths in Muscogee County. June 29 — just four weeks later and two days before the month’s end — there were 1,536 cases and 43 deaths..."
Oh, yeah, that's what it looks like, doesn't it? That's an easy way to make it look like that - compare two points on the death curve. In fact, if you look at the reported deaths -
https://www.google.ca/search?sxsrf=ALeKk02ntIlqt79rKtGWLFk41Wbb_Wdc1g%3A1593616645420&source=hp&ei=Ban8XtrwFoq-tAazjLmQCQ&q=coronavirus+deaths+georgia&oq=coronavirus+deaths+&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAxgAMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIABBDMgoIABCxAxCxAxBDMgQIABBDMgUIABCxAzIICAAQsQMQsQMyBQgAELEDMgUIABCxAzoHCCMQ6gIQJzoHCC4Q6gIQJzoHCAAQsQMQQzoFCAAQkQI6CggAELEDEEMQiwM6DgguELEDEMcBEKMCEIsDOgcIABBDEIsDOg0IABCxAxAUEIcCEIsDOg0IABCxAxCxAxBDEIsDOggIABCxAxCLAzoECAAQCjoNCAAQsQMQsQMQFBCHAlC9I1jMR2CLZGgCcAB4AIAB3AGIAa8SkgEGNy4xMi4xmAEAoAEBqgEHZ3dzLXdperABCrgBAg&sclient=psy-ab
May 30 - 20
31 - 49
June 1 - 36
2 - 13
2 - 21
------
139
28 deaths
June 26 - 25
27 - 6
28 - 2
29 - 6
30 - 21
--------
60
12 deaths
Remember, the caseload and death counts are supposed to be doubling every 5 days (with the lowest estimated Reproduction number of 2). Instead, deaths have halved in a month.
Apr. 19 - 12
20 - 86
21 - 43
22 - 28
23 - 35
---------
204
41 deaths
That doesn't prove that ending the lockdown saved lives, of course; but it's more than enough to prove that the lockdown was not saving lives - that whatever was reducing deaths in April, during the lockdown, was still reducing them in May and June, after it was over.
I strongly suggest you look at the numbers for NY and NJ. We've gotten Covid 19 infections down to manageable rates by using masks and social distancing.
That's probably what did cause the decline: mask wearing, physical distancing, and disinfecting. Not stay-at-home orders (which may have increased deaths in the short term), and not business closings (which probably helped reinforce stay-at-home orders, to an unknown degree, but at a huge also unknown cost). Voluntary changes in behavior in response to a perceived threat.
People changed their behavior in response to perceived risk. Remember, before March the authorities were downplaying the risk - your mayor was taking TV camera crews on subway rides, just to pontificate about show how safe it all was. But, thanks to the media showing pictures of Italy 24/7, people had already begun voluntarily distancing on their own.
The masks help wearer from infecting other people if they have the virus. The protection to the wearer is not as great as the protection of others.
As I've said I've been wearing a mask since February; back when you wear telling me categorically that a mask would not protect me - and even the 'experts' at Public Heath Toronto was telling me not to wear one. Today - four months after the pandemic started here - our mayor made mask wearing mandatory. Am I supposed to now give him the credit? As I see it, he's simply adding insult to injury.
Post by k***@gmail.com
A lot of people died. Because of the high population of these states, the curves are pretty obvious.
Sure, the figures were grim, in Greater New York (gny). The disease followed the same trajectory as everywhere else, but the absolute numbers were so high. high as in Wuhan. Why?
My hypothesis is that it's due to the large Italian community in gny, probably the richest part of the Italian diaspora - millions of Italians have family there, and vice versa.
When a pandemic hits, the rational thing to do is to leave the area entirely as soon as one can. During early March, tens of thousands, Italians left the country, and the logical place for them to go would be ny. If just 10% were infected but pre-symptomatic, that would be hundreds and thousands of patient zeroes starting hundreds and thousands of mini-outbreaks throughout gny, all of them spreading exponentially at first.
Post by k***@gmail.com
Unfortunately, a large portion of the rest of the US will be going through what NJ & NY went though in April and May. NJ is requesting that people coming to NJ from highly infected states self-quarantine to prevent infecting us again.
Well, that's what I have my eye on: hospitalizations and deaths. So far the surge isn't happening.
Post by k***@gmail.com
Protect yourselves. Stay 6ft apart and wear masks and gloves if you have to go out.
I'd like the evidence to show that voluntary social distancing is as effective as government lockdown.
In terms of keeping hospitalizations and deaths down, it's most important that we seniors continue to socially distance - and fortunately there's a government dole that allows them to give up their jobs.
I'm working full time in the lab now. I wear a mask except when I'm in my cube. Everyone must wear a mask, social distance and wash their hands or use sanitizer frequently. Most stores are open but shoppers must wear masks and observe 6ft distance when possible. Restaurants may only serve at outdoor tables spaced far apart, indoor dining has is still banned. This is partly because large groups of young people were observed at seaside bars close to each other and without masks. I will not eat at a restaurant, inside or outside, until I've gotten a vaccine, but we are ordering take-out occasionally to keep favorite restaurants in business until this is over. This is really damaging taverns and bars.
The next generation took me out last week for a belated Father's Day meal. It's the same rules here: patio dining only, directional arrows leading in and out, and everyone wore a mask. The 6 or so tables were full by the time we left, so I hope the company is doing OK. Lots of businesses are going under.
Post by k***@gmail.com
Many NJ restaurants were already BYOB, in general they are staying in business with take-out.
It's so easy for a libertarian like me, fulminating about the lockdown, to forget that the crisis has made us freer in some ways, at least for the emergency period. The defacto repeal of the laws stopping restaurants from delivering alcohol was a giant step in your country's Long March away from Prohibition.
Good news here today is the local libraries are slowly reopening:

==============================================
Dear Customers,

The Chattahoochee Valley Libraries will resume its touch-free Curbside pickup of reserved library materials effective Wednesday, July 1.

During the brief closure branches received an additional round of disinfectant cleaning.

Service will resume at the following times:

· 10:00am - Wednesday July 1 for:
Columbus Public Library
South Columbus Public Library
Marion County Public Library

· 9:30am Thursday July 2 for:
Parks Memorial Public Library

· 10:00am Thursday July 2 for:
Mildred L. Terry Public Library
North Columbus Public Library

Cusseta-Chattahoochee Public Library

All Libraries will be closed Saturday-Monday July 4-6 for the Independence Day holiday.

We appreciate your continued patience and support as we navigate through the challenges of the current pandemic.

Reserve materials for Curbside pickup today.

Sincerely,
Chattahoochee Valley Libraries
==========================================================
k***@gmail.com
2020-07-02 13:33:18 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by George J. Dance
Post by k***@gmail.com
Post by George J. Dance
Post by k***@gmail.com
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
On the same day, though, the state had 25 COVID-19 deaths. The surge in cases, that's happening in both Republican and Democratic states (though you wouldn't know about the latter by reading the news) is being paralleled with a continuous decline in deaths.
Sure, deaths lag new cases by about 23 days or so, so it's easy enough to worry about a coming death surge, but if that were to happen in Georgia, it should already have happened, since the state ended lockdown back on April 24. So what's going on?
I've been looking at the Georgia DPH COVID webpage, and I think there's a clue to the answer there, in the "Demographics" section. Of the 77,000 cases found to date in the state, the clear majority (41,570) are aged 18-49 - 3 demographic groups that have had only 2,858 hospitalizations and only 166 deaths (more than 100 of those 40-49, and just 13 aged 18-29).
I think we're seeing a major shift in social attitudes to the virus, based (as I think is normal and healthy) on putting self-interest first. When people in these age groups saw the virus as a mass killer, they isolated, at least as well as the older folk. However, now that they see it as potentially no worse than a coronavirus cold, more and more of them have started on the path to herd immunity.
If there's a surge in death cases, that could change, but I don't expect one. For one thing, hospitals haven't been "load-shedding" their long-term care patients into nursing homes like they were doing in March. For another, we now have at least one drug that works, and we've also learned about the dangers of ventilators.
TL/DR - yes, cases are surging, but that's not by itself a bad thing.
https://www.wrbl.com/news/local-news/june-brings-a-sharp-rise-in-muscogee-county-covid-19-cases-deaths/?fbclid=IwAR0P79UPMYThgSbC9u5rP22ZR684JOSKRBROV0l0AnrPw4c_y50eaojJxGo
"On June 1, there were 632 cases and 18 COVID-related deaths in Muscogee County. June 29 — just four weeks later and two days before the month’s end — there were 1,536 cases and 43 deaths..."
Oh, yeah, that's what it looks like, doesn't it? That's an easy way to make it look like that - compare two points on the death curve. In fact, if you look at the reported deaths -
https://www.google.ca/search?sxsrf=ALeKk02ntIlqt79rKtGWLFk41Wbb_Wdc1g%3A1593616645420&source=hp&ei=Ban8XtrwFoq-tAazjLmQCQ&q=coronavirus+deaths+georgia&oq=coronavirus+deaths+&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAxgAMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIABBDMgoIABCxAxCxAxBDMgQIABBDMgUIABCxAzIICAAQsQMQsQMyBQgAELEDMgUIABCxAzoHCCMQ6gIQJzoHCC4Q6gIQJzoHCAAQsQMQQzoFCAAQkQI6CggAELEDEEMQiwM6DgguELEDEMcBEKMCEIsDOgcIABBDEIsDOg0IABCxAxAUEIcCEIsDOg0IABCxAxCxAxBDEIsDOggIABCxAxCLAzoECAAQCjoNCAAQsQMQsQMQFBCHAlC9I1jMR2CLZGgCcAB4AIAB3AGIAa8SkgEGNy4xMi4xmAEAoAEBqgEHZ3dzLXdperABCrgBAg&sclient=psy-ab
May 30 - 20
31 - 49
June 1 - 36
2 - 13
2 - 21
------
139
28 deaths
June 26 - 25
27 - 6
28 - 2
29 - 6
30 - 21
--------
60
12 deaths
Remember, the caseload and death counts are supposed to be doubling every 5 days (with the lowest estimated Reproduction number of 2). Instead, deaths have halved in a month.
Apr. 19 - 12
20 - 86
21 - 43
22 - 28
23 - 35
---------
204
41 deaths
That doesn't prove that ending the lockdown saved lives, of course; but it's more than enough to prove that the lockdown was not saving lives - that whatever was reducing deaths in April, during the lockdown, was still reducing them in May and June, after it was over.
I strongly suggest you look at the numbers for NY and NJ. We've gotten Covid 19 infections down to manageable rates by using masks and social distancing.
That's probably what did cause the decline: mask wearing, physical distancing, and disinfecting. Not stay-at-home orders (which may have increased deaths in the short term), and not business closings (which probably helped reinforce stay-at-home orders, to an unknown degree, but at a huge also unknown cost). Voluntary changes in behavior in response to a perceived threat.
People changed their behavior in response to perceived risk. Remember, before March the authorities were downplaying the risk - your mayor was taking TV camera crews on subway rides, just to pontificate about show how safe it all was. But, thanks to the media showing pictures of Italy 24/7, people had already begun voluntarily distancing on their own.
The masks help wearer from infecting other people if they have the virus. The protection to the wearer is not as great as the protection of others.
As I've said I've been wearing a mask since February; back when you wear telling me categorically that a mask would not protect me - and even the 'experts' at Public Heath Toronto was telling me not to wear one. Today - four months after the pandemic started here - our mayor made mask wearing mandatory. Am I supposed to now give him the credit? As I see it, he's simply adding insult to injury.
Post by k***@gmail.com
A lot of people died. Because of the high population of these states, the curves are pretty obvious.
Sure, the figures were grim, in Greater New York (gny). The disease followed the same trajectory as everywhere else, but the absolute numbers were so high. high as in Wuhan. Why?
My hypothesis is that it's due to the large Italian community in gny, probably the richest part of the Italian diaspora - millions of Italians have family there, and vice versa.
When a pandemic hits, the rational thing to do is to leave the area entirely as soon as one can. During early March, tens of thousands, Italians left the country, and the logical place for them to go would be ny. If just 10% were infected but pre-symptomatic, that would be hundreds and thousands of patient zeroes starting hundreds and thousands of mini-outbreaks throughout gny, all of them spreading exponentially at first.
Post by k***@gmail.com
Unfortunately, a large portion of the rest of the US will be going through what NJ & NY went though in April and May. NJ is requesting that people coming to NJ from highly infected states self-quarantine to prevent infecting us again.
Well, that's what I have my eye on: hospitalizations and deaths. So far the surge isn't happening.
Post by k***@gmail.com
Protect yourselves. Stay 6ft apart and wear masks and gloves if you have to go out.
I'd like the evidence to show that voluntary social distancing is as effective as government lockdown.
In terms of keeping hospitalizations and deaths down, it's most important that we seniors continue to socially distance - and fortunately there's a government dole that allows them to give up their jobs.
I'm working full time in the lab now. I wear a mask except when I'm in my cube. Everyone must wear a mask, social distance and wash their hands or use sanitizer frequently. Most stores are open but shoppers must wear masks and observe 6ft distance when possible. Restaurants may only serve at outdoor tables spaced far apart, indoor dining has is still banned. This is partly because large groups of young people were observed at seaside bars close to each other and without masks. I will not eat at a restaurant, inside or outside, until I've gotten a vaccine, but we are ordering take-out occasionally to keep favorite restaurants in business until this is over. This is really damaging taverns and bars.
The next generation took me out last week for a belated Father's Day meal. It's the same rules here: patio dining only, directional arrows leading in and out, and everyone wore a mask. The 6 or so tables were full by the time we left, so I hope the company is doing OK. Lots of businesses are going under.
Post by k***@gmail.com
Many NJ restaurants were already BYOB, in general they are staying in business with take-out.
It's so easy for a libertarian like me, fulminating about the lockdown, to forget that the crisis has made us freer in some ways, at least for the emergency period. The defacto repeal of the laws stopping restaurants from delivering alcohol was a giant step in your country's Long March away from Prohibition.
I was told about how prohibition damaged restaurants when I was a child. My grandfather drove the delivery truck for his father's butter and eggs wholesale business. Because the fancier restaurants suffered, provisioners suffered also.
Van (Van Couver)
2020-07-03 00:11:11 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by George J. Dance
Post by k***@gmail.com
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
On the same day, though, the state had 25 COVID-19 deaths. The surge in cases, that's happening in both Republican and Democratic states (though you wouldn't know about the latter by reading the news) is being paralleled with a continuous decline in deaths.
Sure, deaths lag new cases by about 23 days or so, so it's easy enough to worry about a coming death surge, but if that were to happen in Georgia, it should already have happened, since the state ended lockdown back on April 24. So what's going on?
I've been looking at the Georgia DPH COVID webpage, and I think there's a clue to the answer there, in the "Demographics" section. Of the 77,000 cases found to date in the state, the clear majority (41,570) are aged 18-49 - 3 demographic groups that have had only 2,858 hospitalizations and only 166 deaths (more than 100 of those 40-49, and just 13 aged 18-29).
I think we're seeing a major shift in social attitudes to the virus, based (as I think is normal and healthy) on putting self-interest first. When people in these age groups saw the virus as a mass killer, they isolated, at least as well as the older folk. However, now that they see it as potentially no worse than a coronavirus cold, more and more of them have started on the path to herd immunity.
If there's a surge in death cases, that could change, but I don't expect one. For one thing, hospitals haven't been "load-shedding" their long-term care patients into nursing homes like they were doing in March. For another, we now have at least one drug that works, and we've also learned about the dangers of ventilators.
TL/DR - yes, cases are surging, but that's not by itself a bad thing.
https://www.wrbl.com/news/local-news/june-brings-a-sharp-rise-in-muscogee-county-covid-19-cases-deaths/?fbclid=IwAR0P79UPMYThgSbC9u5rP22ZR684JOSKRBROV0l0AnrPw4c_y50eaojJxGo
"On June 1, there were 632 cases and 18 COVID-related deaths in Muscogee County. June 29 — just four weeks later and two days before the month’s end — there were 1,536 cases and 43 deaths..."
Oh, yeah, that's what it looks like, doesn't it? That's an easy way to make it look like that - compare two points on the death curve. In fact, if you look at the reported deaths -
https://www.google.ca/search?sxsrf=ALeKk02ntIlqt79rKtGWLFk41Wbb_Wdc1g%3A1593616645420&source=hp&ei=Ban8XtrwFoq-tAazjLmQCQ&q=coronavirus+deaths+georgia&oq=coronavirus+deaths+&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAxgAMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIABBDMgoIABCxAxCxAxBDMgQIABBDMgUIABCxAzIICAAQsQMQsQMyBQgAELEDMgUIABCxAzoHCCMQ6gIQJzoHCC4Q6gIQJzoHCAAQsQMQQzoFCAAQkQI6CggAELEDEEMQiwM6DgguELEDEMcBEKMCEIsDOgcIABBDEIsDOg0IABCxAxAUEIcCEIsDOg0IABCxAxCxAxBDEIsDOggIABCxAxCLAzoECAAQCjoNCAAQsQMQsQMQFBCHAlC9I1jMR2CLZGgCcAB4AIAB3AGIAa8SkgEGNy4xMi4xmAEAoAEBqgEHZ3dzLXdperABCrgBAg&sclient=psy-ab
May 30 - 20
31 - 49
June 1 - 36
2 - 13
2 - 21
------
139
28 deaths
June 26 - 25
27 - 6
28 - 2
29 - 6
30 - 21
--------
60
12 deaths
Remember, the caseload and death counts are supposed to be doubling every 5 days (with the lowest estimated Reproduction number of 2). Instead, deaths have halved in a month.
Apr. 19 - 12
20 - 86
21 - 43
22 - 28
23 - 35
---------
204
41 deaths
That doesn't prove that ending the lockdown saved lives, of course; but it's more than enough to prove that the lockdown was not saving lives - that whatever was reducing deaths in April, during the lockdown, was still reducing them in May and June, after it was over.
I strongly suggest you look at the numbers for NY and NJ. We've gotten Covid 19 infections down to manageable rates by using masks and social distancing.
That's probably what did cause the decline: mask wearing, physical distancing, and disinfecting. Not stay-at-home orders (which may have increased deaths in the short term), and not business closings (which probably helped reinforce stay-at-home orders, to an unknown degree, but at a huge also unknown cost). Voluntary changes in behavior in response to a perceived threat.
People changed their behavior in response to perceived risk. Remember, before March the authorities were downplaying the risk - your mayor was taking TV camera crews on subway rides, just to pontificate about show how safe it all was. But, thanks to the media showing pictures of Italy 24/7, people had already begun voluntarily distancing on their own.
The masks help wearer from infecting other people if they have the virus. The protection to the wearer is not as great as the protection of others.
As I've said I've been wearing a mask since February; back when you wear telling me categorically that a mask would not protect me - and even the 'experts' at Public Heath Toronto was telling me not to wear one. Today - four months after the pandemic started here - our mayor made mask wearing mandatory. Am I supposed to now give him the credit? As I see it, he's simply adding insult to injury.
Post by k***@gmail.com
A lot of people died. Because of the high population of these states, the curves are pretty obvious.
Sure, the figures were grim, in Greater New York (gny). The disease followed the same trajectory as everywhere else, but the absolute numbers were so high. high as in Wuhan. Why?
My hypothesis is that it's due to the large Italian community in gny, probably the richest part of the Italian diaspora - millions of Italians have family there, and vice versa.
When a pandemic hits, the rational thing to do is to leave the area entirely as soon as one can. During early March, tens of thousands, Italians left the country, and the logical place for them to go would be ny. If just 10% were infected but pre-symptomatic, that would be hundreds and thousands of patient zeroes starting hundreds and thousands of mini-outbreaks throughout gny, all of them spreading exponentially at first.
Post by k***@gmail.com
Unfortunately, a large portion of the rest of the US will be going through what NJ & NY went though in April and May. NJ is requesting that people coming to NJ from highly infected states self-quarantine to prevent infecting us again.
Well, that's what I have my eye on: hospitalizations and deaths. So far the surge isn't happening.
Post by k***@gmail.com
Protect yourselves. Stay 6ft apart and wear masks and gloves if you have to go out.
I'd like the evidence to show that voluntary social distancing is as effective as government lockdown.
In terms of keeping hospitalizations and deaths down, it's most important that we seniors continue to socially distance - and fortunately there's a government dole that allows them to give up their jobs.
Keep safe G.D.

Will Dockery
2020-07-02 19:24:29 UTC
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Post by k***@gmail.com
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
On the same day, though, the state had 25 COVID-19 deaths. The surge in cases, that's happening in both Republican and Democratic states (though you wouldn't know about the latter by reading the news) is being paralleled with a continuous decline in deaths.
Sure, deaths lag new cases by about 23 days or so, so it's easy enough to worry about a coming death surge, but if that were to happen in Georgia, it should already have happened, since the state ended lockdown back on April 24. So what's going on?
I've been looking at the Georgia DPH COVID webpage, and I think there's a clue to the answer there, in the "Demographics" section. Of the 77,000 cases found to date in the state, the clear majority (41,570) are aged 18-49 - 3 demographic groups that have had only 2,858 hospitalizations and only 166 deaths (more than 100 of those 40-49, and just 13 aged 18-29).
I think we're seeing a major shift in social attitudes to the virus, based (as I think is normal and healthy) on putting self-interest first. When people in these age groups saw the virus as a mass killer, they isolated, at least as well as the older folk. However, now that they see it as potentially no worse than a coronavirus cold, more and more of them have started on the path to herd immunity.
If there's a surge in death cases, that could change, but I don't expect one. For one thing, hospitals haven't been "load-shedding" their long-term care patients into nursing homes like they were doing in March. For another, we now have at least one drug that works, and we've also learned about the dangers of ventilators.
TL/DR - yes, cases are surging, but that's not by itself a bad thing.
https://www.wrbl.com/news/local-news/june-brings-a-sharp-rise-in-muscogee-county-covid-19-cases-deaths/?fbclid=IwAR0P79UPMYThgSbC9u5rP22ZR684JOSKRBROV0l0AnrPw4c_y50eaojJxGo
"On June 1, there were 632 cases and 18 COVID-related deaths in Muscogee County. June 29 — just four weeks later and two days before the month’s end — there were 1,536 cases and 43 deaths..."
Oh, yeah, that's what it looks like, doesn't it? That's an easy way to make it look like that - compare two points on the death curve. In fact, if you look at the reported deaths -
https://www.google.ca/search?sxsrf=ALeKk02ntIlqt79rKtGWLFk41Wbb_Wdc1g%3A1593616645420&source=hp&ei=Ban8XtrwFoq-tAazjLmQCQ&q=coronavirus+deaths+georgia&oq=coronavirus+deaths+&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAxgAMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIABBDMgoIABCxAxCxAxBDMgQIABBDMgUIABCxAzIICAAQsQMQsQMyBQgAELEDMgUIABCxAzoHCCMQ6gIQJzoHCC4Q6gIQJzoHCAAQsQMQQzoFCAAQkQI6CggAELEDEEMQiwM6DgguELEDEMcBEKMCEIsDOgcIABBDEIsDOg0IABCxAxAUEIcCEIsDOg0IABCxAxCxAxBDEIsDOggIABCxAxCLAzoECAAQCjoNCAAQsQMQsQMQFBCHAlC9I1jMR2CLZGgCcAB4AIAB3AGIAa8SkgEGNy4xMi4xmAEAoAEBqgEHZ3dzLXdperABCrgBAg&sclient=psy-ab
May 30 - 20
31 - 49
June 1 - 36
2 - 13
2 - 21
------
139
28 deaths
June 26 - 25
27 - 6
28 - 2
29 - 6
30 - 21
--------
60
12 deaths
Remember, the caseload and death counts are supposed to be doubling every 5 days (with the lowest estimated Reproduction number of 2). Instead, deaths have halved in a month.
Apr. 19 - 12
20 - 86
21 - 43
22 - 28
23 - 35
---------
204
41 deaths
That doesn't prove that ending the lockdown saved lives, of course; but it's more than enough to prove that the lockdown was not saving lives - that whatever was reducing deaths in April, during the lockdown, was still reducing them in May and June, after it was over.
I strongly suggest you look at the numbers for NY and NJ. We've gotten Covid 19 infections down to manageable rates by using masks and social distancing. The masks help wearer from infecting other people if they have the virus. The protection to the wearer is not as great as the protection of others. A lot of people died. Because of the high population of these states, the curves are pretty obvious.
Unfortunately, a large portion of the rest of the US will be going through what NJ & NY went though in April and May. NJ is requesting that people coming to NJ from highly infected states self-quarantine to prevent infecting us again.
Protect yourselves. Stay 6ft apart and wear masks and gloves if you have to go out.
I'm sticking with the mask and limited or no contact with crowds, myself... why risk getting sick even if it may not be fatal?
Michael Pendragon
2020-07-02 19:26:40 UTC
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Post by Will Dockery
Post by k***@gmail.com
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
On the same day, though, the state had 25 COVID-19 deaths. The surge in cases, that's happening in both Republican and Democratic states (though you wouldn't know about the latter by reading the news) is being paralleled with a continuous decline in deaths.
Sure, deaths lag new cases by about 23 days or so, so it's easy enough to worry about a coming death surge, but if that were to happen in Georgia, it should already have happened, since the state ended lockdown back on April 24. So what's going on?
I've been looking at the Georgia DPH COVID webpage, and I think there's a clue to the answer there, in the "Demographics" section. Of the 77,000 cases found to date in the state, the clear majority (41,570) are aged 18-49 - 3 demographic groups that have had only 2,858 hospitalizations and only 166 deaths (more than 100 of those 40-49, and just 13 aged 18-29).
I think we're seeing a major shift in social attitudes to the virus, based (as I think is normal and healthy) on putting self-interest first. When people in these age groups saw the virus as a mass killer, they isolated, at least as well as the older folk. However, now that they see it as potentially no worse than a coronavirus cold, more and more of them have started on the path to herd immunity.
If there's a surge in death cases, that could change, but I don't expect one. For one thing, hospitals haven't been "load-shedding" their long-term care patients into nursing homes like they were doing in March. For another, we now have at least one drug that works, and we've also learned about the dangers of ventilators.
TL/DR - yes, cases are surging, but that's not by itself a bad thing.
https://www.wrbl.com/news/local-news/june-brings-a-sharp-rise-in-muscogee-county-covid-19-cases-deaths/?fbclid=IwAR0P79UPMYThgSbC9u5rP22ZR684JOSKRBROV0l0AnrPw4c_y50eaojJxGo
"On June 1, there were 632 cases and 18 COVID-related deaths in Muscogee County. June 29 — just four weeks later and two days before the month’s end — there were 1,536 cases and 43 deaths..."
Oh, yeah, that's what it looks like, doesn't it? That's an easy way to make it look like that - compare two points on the death curve. In fact, if you look at the reported deaths -
https://www.google.ca/search?sxsrf=ALeKk02ntIlqt79rKtGWLFk41Wbb_Wdc1g%3A1593616645420&source=hp&ei=Ban8XtrwFoq-tAazjLmQCQ&q=coronavirus+deaths+georgia&oq=coronavirus+deaths+&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAxgAMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIIxAnMgQIABBDMgoIABCxAxCxAxBDMgQIABBDMgUIABCxAzIICAAQsQMQsQMyBQgAELEDMgUIABCxAzoHCCMQ6gIQJzoHCC4Q6gIQJzoHCAAQsQMQQzoFCAAQkQI6CggAELEDEEMQiwM6DgguELEDEMcBEKMCEIsDOgcIABBDEIsDOg0IABCxAxAUEIcCEIsDOg0IABCxAxCxAxBDEIsDOggIABCxAxCLAzoECAAQCjoNCAAQsQMQsQMQFBCHAlC9I1jMR2CLZGgCcAB4AIAB3AGIAa8SkgEGNy4xMi4xmAEAoAEBqgEHZ3dzLXdperABCrgBAg&sclient=psy-ab
May 30 - 20
31 - 49
June 1 - 36
2 - 13
2 - 21
------
139
28 deaths
June 26 - 25
27 - 6
28 - 2
29 - 6
30 - 21
--------
60
12 deaths
Remember, the caseload and death counts are supposed to be doubling every 5 days (with the lowest estimated Reproduction number of 2). Instead, deaths have halved in a month.
Apr. 19 - 12
20 - 86
21 - 43
22 - 28
23 - 35
---------
204
41 deaths
That doesn't prove that ending the lockdown saved lives, of course; but it's more than enough to prove that the lockdown was not saving lives - that whatever was reducing deaths in April, during the lockdown, was still reducing them in May and June, after it was over.
I strongly suggest you look at the numbers for NY and NJ. We've gotten Covid 19 infections down to manageable rates by using masks and social distancing. The masks help wearer from infecting other people if they have the virus. The protection to the wearer is not as great as the protection of others. A lot of people died. Because of the high population of these states, the curves are pretty obvious.
Unfortunately, a large portion of the rest of the US will be going through what NJ & NY went though in April and May. NJ is requesting that people coming to NJ from highly infected states self-quarantine to prevent infecting us again.
Protect yourselves. Stay 6ft apart and wear masks and gloves if you have to go out.
I'm sticking with the mask and limited or no contact with crowds, myself... why risk getting sick even if it may not be fatal?
A wise idea.

Why not carry that over to internet as well?
m***@yahoo.com
2020-06-29 20:34:16 UTC
Reply
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Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
And yet, your liver still functions. (sigh)
Zod-The-Mighty
2020-07-02 00:10:27 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Will Dockery
Post by George J. Dance
Last week the Wisconsin Supreme Court ruled that the state government's lockdown was unconstitutional - that the executive's power to make emergency laws without the consent of the legislature was limited.
Since Wisconsin is philo's neck of the woods, I thought that might be worth discussing.
https://patch.com/georgia/midtown/s/h5rkn/georgia-reports-1-900-new-covid-19-cases-sets-single-day-record?utm_source=alert-breakingnews&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert
"ATLANTA, GA — Georgia set a record Friday for new COVID-19 cases recorded in a 24-hour period: 1,900 cases in a day..."
Zounds, what a year this has been....
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